Hansiman (EUNE)
: > everyone I know will admit to flaming atleast once in their league career or atleast most people. Most of those who claim they never stepped over the line are probably not being quite thruthful. It's perfectly normal to step over the line once or twice; I can't claim I've never done so myself. --- > Alright thanks bud I'll add you later and we can talk or tommorow. I'll be heading to bed now. I'll be online tomorrow, but I have a late shift at work.
Yeah true, anyways added ya 'I make KR plays'.
Hansiman (EUNE)
: > 4000+ games of being positive though reflects next to nothing. Doesn't mean anything. It doesn't mean anything if your recent behaviour is sub-standard. Past good behaviour doesn't excuse current bad behaviour. --- > I believe everyone has a limit and me tilting because of the COMMUNITY being bad and this is not a lie Blaming other people for your personal actions doesn't work as an excuse. Nobody forced you to do what you did. You even stated that you made a choice to be toxic, before you even queued up. Nobody forced you to make that decision. That was all you. --- > the community is infamously toxic. Not fairly so. There's a small minority that is toxic. However, the issue is that this is a very vocal minority, making them seem much larger in numbers than they really are. From data Riot has released, roughly 5% of the community behaves in such a manner that warrants a penalty. Does 5% misbehaving players mean that the community itself is toxic? What about the other 95% that are neutral or friendly? Most players don't say much ingame, because they're focused on playing. There's also the matter that roughly 80% of the toxic behaviour you encounter actually comes from the 95%, but they just happen to burst in that one game you encounter them in. However, they'll normally behave perfectly fine, which is why they don't get punished. The rest of the 20% of the toxic behaviour you encounter comes from that 5% of the community that deserves penalties. That shows that this small group is misbehaving far more than the average player, which is why they get penalties. When you're being punished so much that it leads to a permanent suspension, it does indicate that you're not seeing the big picture. I've been a part of the Player Behaviour community since I started playing this game in 2012, and I've literally talked to well over 1000 players. A common 'problem' I see with players that are punished is that they don't see that the behaviour they displayed isn't ok. They'll say "I get that Part A was toxic, but Part B wasn't", and the rest of the community feels that both Part A and B are unwanted types of behaviours. If you want, I will gladly help you go through your logs and identify all the types of behaviour you're displaying that may be the reasoning for your penalties. You may find things that you weren't expecting.
Alright thanks bud I'll add you later and we can talk or tommorow. Thanks for the reply's n stuff, yeah i'll agree that it's a vocal minority etc but what I mean is everyone I know will admit to flaming atleast once in their league career or atleast most people.
Hansiman (EUNE)
: You're forgetting about how I mentioned that percentages matter. Let's turn your example a bit: > 4-5k games and being toxic in 50 Let's say that we have two players that matches that statement Player A is toxic in 50 games evenly spread out amongst 5000 games. Player B is toxic in his 50 last games in 5000 games. Since the system focuses on recent games played when it comes to behaviour, which person is more likely to be punished? Player B has been toxic in 100% of his recent games, while Player A would have a much lower percentage. See what I'm getting at here?
I get you mate I don't disagree. But bad days happen, and to be banned over less games then I would play a day is a bit tilting. I don't disagree but that's my stance on that. ^^ You play League like I do. Every game there is probably 2 people out of 10 talking shit. I have no idea how I am in 0.0006% of banned players lol Do you have an euw account? Would be cool to talk to you on chat to go over some points. :P
Hansiman (EUNE)
: You're forgetting about how I mentioned that percentages matter. Let's turn your example a bit: > 4-5k games and being toxic in 50 Let's say that we have two players that matches that statement Player A is toxic in 50 games evenly spread out amongst 5000 games. Player B is toxic in his 50 last games in 5000 games. Since the system focuses on recent games played when it comes to behaviour, which person is more likely to be punished? Player B has been toxic in 100% of his recent games, while Player A would have a much lower percentage. See what I'm getting at here?
I get you mate I don't disagree. But bad days happen, and to be banned over less games then I would play a day is a bit tilting. I don't disagree but that's my stance on that. ^^ You play League like I do. Every game there is probably 2 people out of 10 talking shit. I have no idea how I am in 0.0006% of banned players lol
Hansiman (EUNE)
: > but wouldn't any normal person be mad? Being mad is perfectly normal, and part of being human. However, being toxic in the chat is a choice, and not 'normal', if you can put it like that. Using the chat is a choice you make, and using it in a derogatory manner is a decision made by you. Part of what makes us human is that we have self control, and we can decide to not use the chat. --- > 0 reward for ignoring it You want to be rewarded for not responding to derogatory behaviour? That's.. odd. --- > blocking them or reporting does nothing? There's no system to block certain players from being queued up with you. Other games that have tried such systems had to disable them, because they were flawed. Overwatch, by Blizzard, had such a system, but they had to disable it. Reporting people does do something, as you yourself can see with your punishment. Your permaban is the direct result of your behaviour and reports made against you. When it comes to intentionally feeding, it's handled by a different system than the one that handles verbal abuse. Now, I'll admit that this system isn't good enough yet, but it's there, and being constantly improved. We weekly see threads from people complaining about getting banned for intentionally feeding, which suggests that it is working, just not well enough. Every accurate report you send against players intentionally feeding helps Riot improve the system, since it provides them with more data. It's important to report players when they're breaking the rules.
What I mean by 0 reward is if I get trolled e.g disco nunu and play the game out. That's atleast 15 minutes wasted and -LP. Say out of 100 games 10 games I was trolled. That's over an hour of time wasted. If despite this I ignored it and didn't say anything I get no reward for that. If someone trolls you and you don't 'vent' you don't get a reward. But if you do vent in chat you'll get banned. Yeah after a lenglthy talk with Riot I understand what reports do now, but back when I had my account I saw it like this. Wow this guy Disco nunu'ed me i'll dodge lose promo's w/e. Oh wow got him again. Why is he not banned? Damn he flamed that game unlucky I got him again. Oh got him again and he wants to open mid 4 minutes in... reported again... 5 games later... still getting him... As a player I just see this as a total disrespect to my reports and I see it as the system not working. This is what made me tilt in the first place. I chose to be toxic before I even qued up. That was my whole problem. I saw the system as 'faulty' and that people could 'talk shit' to me and 'troll me' with no punishment. So I said to myself, next person that trolls or talks shit to me i'm just going AFK. Shortly after I was banned. 4000+ games of being positive though reflects next to nothing. Doesn't mean anything. I believe everyone has a limit and me tilting because of the COMMUNITY being bad and this is not a lie, the community is infamously toxic. ^^ :P
: Chat logs or didn't happen.
My chat logs are toxic I'm not saying they wern't. Some of them I disagree with but some showed evidence of me flaming/afk. But this was less then 0.5% of my total games. I wasn't 'consistently' negative. I think any player who takes the games seriously at high elo would tilt after getting matched with the same troll more then once. Or if not atleast I did.
: I'll admit I went off on certain players, I literally went AFK and talked shit to them. But this was because I had been through so many games of ignoring it with little to no reward from Riot for doing so. Then when I realised that people were proceeding to troll me more then once? This just drove me crazy honestly. I admit to AFK/Hardflame but this was in retaliation and in so little games. Thanks for the reply anyway ^ ^ I don't disagree I was toxic, but wouldn't any normal person be mad? I mean getting trolled by the same player multiple times, 0 reward for ignoring it and blocking them or reporting does nothing?
And by bigger picture, I meant, if I had 4-5k games and was toxic in less then... let's up the toxic games to 50 for this example. 4-5k games and being toxic in 50... I mean everyone has a bad game sometimes looking at this rationally and realisticly. It's much easier to have 1 toxic game the more games you play. Someone who plays 1000000 games is more likely to have 1 toxic game then someone who plays 100 games.
: I mean, your experience and time means nothing, everybody is treated the exact same so if you break the rules you'll suffer the consequences the exact same despite elo or time. It doesn't matter how many times you were toxic, you didn't learn from your past experiences and I feel like justice was served.
Yeah I continued to be toxic, but after my 2 week ban I did quit the game because I didn't like what I was doing. Then after returning I was banned off pretty much 1 game out of 130+. I wasn't exactly consistently negative.
Hansiman (EUNE)
: Greetings. It's very hard for players here to comment directly on your situation, since we don't have access to your logs, or any details regarding your penalties. All we see is what you write here, which tends to just be one side of the story. --- > I would just love and appreciate if Riot were to look at the bigger picture when Issuing a ban on a player. You admit to flaming people, which is the bottom line of your penalty. If you violate the rules, it doesn't matter what other people did. Your case is only about how you behave, and other people will get their own cases where their behaviour is on trial. There's no need for a 'bigger picture'. The big picture is that you were breaking the rules. One rule violation from another doesn't warrant a rule violation from yourself. --- > I had more then 4000 games on my account. I was banned over less games in total then I used to play in a day! This is where things get a bit more challenging to comment. If you were mildly offensive, you wouldn't be banned for 'less games than you play in a day', since the system doesn't look at report accumulated, but rather a percentage of games where you're misbehaving. This allows the system to treat casual and hardcore players equally, and it doesn't punish the fact that a person that plays 4000 games naturally will have some more reports against them than a person that plays 100 games within the same timeframe. However, it **is** quite possible to be banned for a single game of misbehaviour, regardless of how many games you've played. These penalties are for very severe cases of verbal misbehaviour, and include cases of racism, homophobia, death threats, sexism, etc. The very very extreme cases. --- > My 2 week ban was from (1) game. My permanent ban was from (2) games. Are you basing this on the chat logs you were sent? The logs you are provided with are only an example of the games you were correctly reported in, but it doesn't cover all of the games. I believe a random sample of up to 3 games can be selected to be displayed in your log, but you may have been identified to be using unwanted behaviour in far more games than that. --- > For example if someone has 4 people int'ing on his team and he calls them 'stupid trolls'... should this player really get punished for being toxic? If it's a single case, no, he shouldn't, and most likely wouldn't. However, if he's calling everyone he encounters having a bad game as "stupid trolls", then we're starting to paint a bigger picture as to what type of behaviour this person displays. Your example here is also a bit on the extreme side, and I hope you know that. The odds of encountering 4 people on a team that truly is **intentionally** feeding is very low.
I'll admit I went off on certain players, I literally went AFK and talked shit to them. But this was because I had been through so many games of ignoring it with little to no reward from Riot for doing so. Then when I realised that people were proceeding to troll me more then once? This just drove me crazy honestly. I admit to AFK/Hardflame but this was in retaliation and in so little games. Thanks for the reply anyway ^ ^ I don't disagree I was toxic, but wouldn't any normal person be mad? I mean getting trolled by the same player multiple times, 0 reward for ignoring it and blocking them or reporting does nothing?
: I mean, your experience and time means nothing, everybody is treated the exact same so if you break the rules you'll suffer the consequences the exact same despite elo or time. It doesn't matter how many times you were toxic, you didn't learn from your past experiences and I feel like justice was served.
Yeah true. I don't disagree I was toxic but I held it in for months with 0 reward from Riot for ignoring such players and they continued to get matched with me. At the time it bothered me alot. I'd assumed blocking someone means you never get them again, or reporting someone for disco nunu would = ban but seems not :(.
: Hope you get unbanned
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AlphaLeadsTheWay

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