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: Quinn's biggest design flaw I only just noticed.
I wanna see a dancing, taunting bird.
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Thy Red (EUW)
: mine is not an argument, is a suggestion: all i know is i play him support and it works wonderfully
> [{quoted}](name=Thy Red,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=3vcEWot6,comment-id=000200000001,timestamp=2015-03-26T21:40:43.579+0000) > > mine is not an argument, is a suggestion: all i know is i play him support and it works wonderfully I don't know how it works as a support. There are tons of better pics that do what he does more reliably. Slow? Get malphite, it's targeted and won't hit CS. CC ult? Malphite again. His shield? Morgana is better, and her snare is far better if you hit it, and it won't push you lane or take cs.. I'd say Braum's is better too. As i said, I see more potential in Amumu support honestly, if we're putting champs where they don't belong anyway. I simply ask how he works as a support, considering Braum and Leona pretty much guarantee you will get your ult instantly interrupted. So either your enemies don't know Galio (which is a fair chance, considering he's not played for obvious reason), or they are plain bad in their picks.
: "construct feedback or i will demolish your argument".... wow ok calm down edgemaster flex. 2edgy4me. its not as if your arguments are solid. lets say theoretically we DO take galio support. morgana isnt "outclassing" him, as her strength lies in a unique ability that noone can compete with because noone has. so are you saying noone is viable support because "morgana outclasses" them? galio has more ranged damage and a CC effect that can ignore creepblock. that in itself has uses. following on from that, galio's theoretical support strength comes from a completely different angle then morgana. morg works well vs tanks because of thier reliance on CC but galio's MR scaling means he would more then likely see more play in an anti-poke setup vs say an annie, lulu or perhaps zyra where he could afford to do stuff like bush checking and aggressive zoning. so he could me the counter-harass support, where morgana is the counter-CC pick. two completely different approaches. pushing your lane is a groundless counterargument. every support with harass has the ability to push lane. do people NOT pick morgana, zyra, lulu ect because of thier AoE spells? i seem to recall the AoE damage is part of thier strength rather then thier weakness as it allows for effective zoning. pushing the wave is a matter of personal skill and decision making. not "you will push the wave because you can ONLY dump spells off cooldown". got a laugh out of "what happens if your enemies go to the left or to the right". well thats called dodging. so.... are you telling us to NEVER play anyone whos skills might be dodged? looks like its ryze in all lanes then. again this is more personal skill and awareness then the champ which leads me to believe that your problems with the champ stem partly from you not playing him well enough. galio's problem is that hes a noobchamp. hes the brainless answer to AP champs. "pick this dude he does loads of damage if you build to ignore your opponent". which makes him cancerous. he can NEVER be allowed to be competitive because it would make all AP champs as counterpickable as solotop trynd. if his skills were easier to land, if his MR scaling was any better and WORST of all if you gave him a fcking wallhopping leap like all the other hated mobility mids so he just cant be ganked full stop, then he would be pick-or-ban because him being open would mean you have to either last pick your mid or go AD. no champ should win based purely on pick. its supposed to give you SOME mechanical advantages like a bit of range, or burst vs sustain damage. not "you pick AP so my damage is max and yours is none". even his ult is supremely annoying. on someone who can go fulltank and still win midlane with easy farm post-chalice, having an AoE taunt is strong. the fact it needs setting up is the price he pays for having it. same goes for melee autos. you are supposed to mitigate thier damage purely through how easy it is to build MR on galio. if he was able to do that AND farm at range from level one (seriously get chalice, two Qs and an E clears a wave) then he would be safer then orianna. galio is a niche champion and really thats all he can ever be without being olaf'ed because of what he is. everyone who fits a niche position is kept like this. they maybe get a bit of time in the sun if they arent TOO niche but if its massively game-changing it wont be made strong, just fairly good if picked in the right comp.
> [{quoted}](name=Evil Squidward,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=3vcEWot6,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-03-26T15:48:12.138+0000) > > "construct feedback or i will demolish your argument".... wow ok calm down edgemaster flex. 2edgy4me. > > its not as if your arguments are solid. lets say theoretically we DO take galio support. morgana isnt "outclassing" him, as her strength lies in a unique ability that noone can compete with because noone has. so are you saying noone is viable support because "morgana outclasses" them? galio has more ranged damage and a CC effect that can ignore creepblock. that in itself has uses. > > following on from that, galio's theoretical support strength comes from a completely different angle then morgana. morg works well vs tanks because of thier reliance on CC but galio's MR scaling means he would more then likely see more play in an anti-poke setup vs say an annie, lulu or perhaps zyra where he could afford to do stuff like bush checking and aggressive zoning. so he could me the counter-harass support, where morgana is the counter-CC pick. two completely different approaches. > > pushing your lane is a groundless counterargument. every support with harass has the ability to push lane. do people NOT pick morgana, zyra, lulu ect because of thier AoE spells? i seem to recall the AoE damage is part of thier strength rather then thier weakness as it allows for effective zoning. pushing the wave is a matter of personal skill and decision making. not "you will push the wave because you can ONLY dump spells off cooldown". > > got a laugh out of "what happens if your enemies go to the left or to the right". well thats called dodging. so.... are you telling us to NEVER play anyone whos skills might be dodged? looks like its ryze in all lanes then. again this is more personal skill and awareness then the champ which leads me to believe that your problems with the champ stem partly from you not playing him well enough. > > galio's problem is that hes a noobchamp. hes the brainless answer to AP champs. "pick this dude he does loads of damage if you build to ignore your opponent". which makes him cancerous. he can NEVER be allowed to be competitive because it would make all AP champs as counterpickable as solotop trynd. if his skills were easier to land, if his MR scaling was any better and WORST of all if you gave him a fcking wallhopping leap like all the other hated mobility mids so he just cant be ganked full stop, then he would be pick-or-ban because him being open would mean you have to either last pick your mid or go AD. > > no champ should win based purely on pick. its supposed to give you SOME mechanical advantages like a bit of range, or burst vs sustain damage. not "you pick AP so my damage is max and yours is none". > > even his ult is supremely annoying. on someone who can go fulltank and still win midlane with easy farm post-chalice, having an AoE taunt is strong. the fact it needs setting up is the price he pays for having it. > > same goes for melee autos. you are supposed to mitigate thier damage purely through how easy it is to build MR on galio. if he was able to do that AND farm at range from level one (seriously get chalice, two Qs and an E clears a wave) then he would be safer then orianna. > > galio is a niche champion and really thats all he can ever be without being olaf'ed because of what he is. everyone who fits a niche position is kept like this. they maybe get a bit of time in the sun if they arent TOO niche but if its massively game-changing it wont be made strong, just fairly good if picked in the right comp. Alright, I will admit that upon reading that that sounds a tad aggressive. Was going for smug, I failed. I hereby apoligize. However, what you are saying is not really addressing any issues. This CC effect that ignores creepblock also steals CS in the best case. In the worst case you will go oom and be useless. And you took my what happens if enemies go left or right out of context. I was talking about the speedboost from Gust which is not usefull for chasing in many situations like for example ANY other speedboost given to teammates because it forces you to walk in a straight line. You misinterpretted. That being said I still believe his skillshots are rather hard to hit. I'm not saying he should win purely based on pick, where did I say that? What I did say is REGARDLESS of your argument of him being a solid pick against Annie, Leblanc and what not, you don't see him. Meaning he's not niche at all, but he's actually not a counter because he can't control the game. How so? He is unreliable, something I don't think Riot intends any champion to be. Heck, how long did it take them to fix his Ult/tenacity problem? Or was that "counterplay" as well? He is not a noobchamp. His ult requires the most carefull timing of any ult. Honestly, your arguments are bad. Migitating damage from building MR? In what world does Galio start with 200 MR? You're talking about endgame, I'm talking about laning.
: He's completely fine but like you say him being melee is an issue. They should make him have ranged auto attack like literally all mages so he doesn't have to take so much harass or go oom for a few CS.
> [{quoted}](name=A Chocobo,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=3vcEWot6,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-03-26T12:56:34.703+0000) > > He's completely fine but like you say him being melee is an issue. > > They should make him have ranged auto attack like literally all mages so he doesn't have to take so much harass or go oom for a few CS. This would only remove one of his issues. Maybe it would be enough but as it stands he might be the champ with the MOST counterplay. I thought nunu was worse but he really isn't since you still have to manually CC him. Whereas with Galio it get's done for you, you also can't brush ult like nunu for the same reason.
Mimijin (EUNE)
: I love beefy champs but there is something about Galio that is not right. And I don't think its his slow Q. Think about it, enemy picks a mid ap, and you pick Galio. Your team is now forced to pick something that will actually kill and carry, cause clearly even if you get fed you cant do much anyway. If you mid opponent is clever enough they will ignore you pick mobility boots and gank top/bot 24/7. You ll end up getting a few necessary items for Galio, like chalice, visage or whatever, and there is just one thing left for you to do. Use your ulti without getting interrupted at the perfect time of the team fight and then get the hell out of there cause you got nothing more to do. And that's the best case scenario, the one that occurs more often is you getting your ult interrupted while the opponents melting your team.
> [{quoted}](name=Mimijin,realm=EUNE,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=3vcEWot6,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-03-26T12:45:35.843+0000) > > I love beefy champs but there is something about Galio that is not right. And I don't think its his slow Q. Think about it, enemy picks a mid ap, and you pick Galio. Your team is now forced to pick something that will actually kill and carry, cause clearly even if you get fed you cant do much anyway. If you mid opponent is clever enough they will ignore you pick mobility boots and gank top/bot 24/7. You ll end up getting a few necessary items for Galio, like chalice, visage or whatever, and there is just one thing left for you to do. Use your ulti without getting interrupted at the perfect time of the team fight and then get the hell out of there cause you got nothing more to do. And that's the best case scenario, the one that occurs more often is you getting your ult interrupted while the opponents melting your team. So do you think giving his a dash on his E would fix him? One that can be canceled by a root or stun or the likes, as Lissandra? If so. Upvote my post. :)
: An in depth view of Galio
I would like to add that even WITH the changes I suggest, AD casters would still shit on him. He has no passive for them.
Thy Red (EUW)
: Play him support...
> [{quoted}](name=Thy Red,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=3vcEWot6,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-03-26T12:34:36.906+0000) > > Play him support... And then? Be outclassed by morgana? Amumu is a more viable support. Again, why don't you construct your feedback? How is playing him support helping him with his poor harass? Also, you won't be rushing chalice, and enemies will simply stand in their minions so you push with each Q, while you have zero escape mechanisms to escape ganks. Also, how will you use your ult without flash? E only works in a straight line, which also pushes your lane. And what happens when enemies go to the left or right? Or even worse, have an on-hit effect on their support (braum, leona) or morgana simply shields her ADC from your puny CC since it's so easy to see coming. You sir are not making any point. Construct feedback, or I will demolish your argument.
: Almost everything from this list is bullsh*t.The heal is good, you can poke with abilities but not that much.But yes it really feels bad to farm with melee attacks.Feels so weird.At first I tought that {{champion:3}} was ranged.He doesn't look like a melee champion at all :/
> [{quoted}](name=XxRNxX,realm=EUNE,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=3vcEWot6,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-26T12:23:32.223+0000) > > Almost everything from this list is bullsh*t.The heal is good, you can poke with abilities but not that much.But yes it really feels bad to farm with melee attacks.Feels so weird.At first I tought that {{champion:3}} was ranged.He doesn't look like a melee champion at all :/ You didn't read properly then, since every argument is well constructed. You can't counter the argument by saying it's bullsh*t, come with valid counter arguments then we'll talk. His abilities can't farm for shit untill he has chalice. And even then you have a mana pool that allows a whopping 2 combo's (Q+E) . His W only becomes good AFTER a certain amount of AP and when it's level 3 at least. Good luck leveling that one before Q and E. Come with a valid argument why his heal would be considered "good" at level 1. Again. I like constructive feedback. Yours isn't.
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Mundonator

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