: fun no mana/energy champions
Prudent (EUW)
: Loading Takes around 4.32decades?
From personal experience it actually takes just 4.31 decades, so alot shorter than you make it out to be.
Shiwah (EUW)
: 1+1=2
: She wasn't OP. She got her well-deserved buffs to raise her out of oblivion just at the time anything around her was nerfed. And instead of buffing champions, Riot ofc goes the quickfix of nerving Quinn instead to ensure she stays in oblivion while the never-ending set of similar champions stays in the metapool.
She was't OP? She had winrates well above 50%. I even remember that for a short time she was top tier in literally every single role, even Support. You could pick her anywhere and outdamage everyone. The knockback made it impossible for her enemies to engage on her, she was always the first one to attack you. And even if you managed to survive her burst, the Blind made it impossible to trade back. You were dead before the Blind ended, every single time. She was most popular in top, as she would beat every toplaner during the laningphase. And in the midgame she outburst and outdamaged everyone with ease. After dominating early to midgame, she could be everywhere on the map, due to easy roaming with her ult, killing the other enemies and pusing her lead even further. Basically, Quinn has no issues during laningphase and snowballed out of control. Even Riot said Quinn is OP and they are going to fix it by nerfing her. But also reworking Electrocute and changing both Duskblade and Stormrazor so they share a unique passive should put her back in line. The unique passive is supposed to make building both items less powerful. These changes are going to hit hard and Quinn will most likely be in the gutter after that again. The problem is Quinn just doesn't work as a champion. She is an ADC that plays like an assassin. She dives to kill someone, but unlike an assassin she can't get out again, because she is an ADC. So after going in she just dies. She's a suicide bomber. The only way to make Quinn work is to break her like she was last month. Because if she kills everyone, then no one is going to kill her. Why try to get out of the fight if you can blow up everyone?
Glaiver (EUNE)
: It's sad that some champions stay viable longer while others drop like anchors with small changes
Have you played LoL in the last month? Quinn was OP (and still is imo) and she was picked in basically every game in which she wasn't banned.
Ceberuz (EUW)
: Reflection is taking it a little to far, but I do appreciate the compliment.., just so you know, that advice applies to subjects bound in realism.
Then why are pretty much all your comments not found in realism?
Ceberuz (EUW)
: I get, it's another of your jokes that no one gets?
A wise man once told me, I should reflect over things I say, then I'll be able to see what everyone else sees and drop the act and seek help. Maybe you should do that too. [](https://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/off-topic-en/zy0H3VFU-i-am-so-god-damn-angry?comment=0007) And let's be serious here, when was I ever joking?
Febos (EUW)
: People like you forget that [Mechs vs Minions](https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/featured/mechs-vs-minions) is a thing. Riot **Games**.
But that boardgame is also just one single game. So still Riot **GAME**. Checkmate atheists.
Ceberuz (EUW)
: On what planet?
Apparently not on yours.
: Why is MMR a thing?
Because it works.
Ceberuz (EUW)
: Are you saying you aren't mentally ill?- if so you should read your own post and reflect over it, I am sure you'll be able to see the same as the rest viewing it, perhaps then you'll drop the act and seek help.
I was genuinely angry for weeks now and this post helped me get off alot of steam. The first time in a long time where I feel relaxed instead of angry. There is no act. I am genuinely afraid.
HazyWolf2 (EUW)
: Warum sind tower so viel leben haben
Die Tower sind als Hindernis gedacht. Klar sind die nicht einfach zu überwältigen!
: You cannot defend what you don't know about. The foreshadow exploit.
: Let’s not discuss religion on the boards as 1: it’s a broad term, and if I were cheeky, I would say that reincarnation is a belief too, in a certain religion... but you seem to have used the word ’religion’ as though it meant the same as ’Christianity’ or some other religion that revolves around a god; and 2: it’s a video game forum and this is not the place.
> 2: it’s a video game forum and this is not the place. In Off-Topic you can post whatever you want. Really. To this day I have not seen a single person who got banned for anything posted in Off-Topic.
: Alright, let's have a little impromptu therapy session here shall we. First of all, mental illness doesn't necessarily mean being psychotic as in being unable to properly perceive and process the world around you. The most common forms of mental illness like depression actually don't usually show themselves in the form of any kind of "insanity" but rather just slightly alter your perception of reality by making everything seem hopeless and shitty. You might want to talk to close friends or family about what you're going through, maybe they can help. We all go through rough patches at times, and as silly as it sounds just having someone close to you around to talk to can often help more than you'd think. If that's not an option for you for whatever reason, and you're actually experiencing things like panic attacks or depression across longer timespans, you should consider talking to a proper therapist. Now to the good news, at least about the death part I can reassure you there isn't really anything to be afraid of. Once you die, you simply cease to exist. There is no "afterwards". As soon as your consciousness disintegrates upon death, the world around you, even reality itself just ends. An odd thought, and perhaps something that coming to terms with might take a while, but not really something to be afraid of. And I doubt religion would help with fear of death anyway, you'd just be tearing yourself up over whether you really deserve to go to heaven or whether you'll suffer eternal damnation in hell (loving god btw...).
People tell themself death is fine, because they rather want it instead of fearing it. Every religion out there paints a better existance after life, may it be heaven in christianity, or the nirvana in hindu or whatever, but ultimately people don't wanna die and to make things pleseant they paint death wonderfully. Because if you can look forward to death, then you don't fear it. It's absurd. Life is everything we have. And for whatever reason we are supposed to like that we will lose even that. And for all we know, we have no idea what happens afterwards. It could be nothing, but it could be something entirely different. You don't know, I don't know, everyone else doesn't know. You cannot prove that there is nothing after death, neither can you that there is something. You cannot prove that god exists, neither can you that he doesn't. And conciousness makes things even more cloudy. Like what the hell is it? And how the %%%% can you explain it scientifically? How can you prove to me that you are real and not some stupid image inside my mind? The world is so stupid. It's so %%%%ing pointless. Nothing makes sense and I can't take it anymore. %%%%ing hell.
Rioter Comments
Father Tios (EUNE)
: So why league is worse than before?
The question I am asking is _how_ is it worse? Because all I see are entitled nostalgia driven delusional players who are too stubborn to adapt and rather cry about it.
Naranjo1 (EUNE)
: What season do you consider the best?
: > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=7acup6vZ,comment-id=00010001000000000000,timestamp=2018-08-13T18:50:02.939+0000) > > No, you miss the point. It doesn't matter if you went afk intentionally or not, because it still ruins the experience. Even if Riot wouldn't want to punish unintentional afks, they still have the issue that they can't detect what's intentionally or not. > > Also just to note punishment are designed to suck. If they wouldn't be annoying, no one would care. Well, then maybe, just maybe, riot should fix their god damn game so people wouldn't get bugsplats?
Most people don't have an issue though. It's mostly the users fault when something breaks, not the game.
: hmmm! logic maybe? because i don't see that getting 30 minutes suspension for 20 games is reasonable lol i'm the one punished and i express my thoughts about this system that i see -imp- not fair.
I told you already, you had to leave multiple times to get a punishment like this. You could've prevented this. And you are totally not logical. I mean don't you see the fallacy in your request? You don't like x punishment, so you request a lighter one. Punishments are supposed to suck, or else why would you punish players? If you are okay with a punishment, then the punishment failed to be a punishment.
: that's where getting 0 LP + an amount of reasonable games suspension should pop out.
how do you know what is reasonable? You are the one who is punished and is writing out of emotions!
: if someone on my team goes AFK, and we won the game, then yes i want him to get punished, because he tried to ruin my game experience, but if it was up to me i would say that he deserve not getting LP of that Victory game and getting 20 minutes x5 Games suspension. if We lost the game because of that guy who went AFK, then he deserve to be punished for making other 4 players losing LP because of him, so i would say he should get something like high LP loss (let's say the Double of the lp he would have lost if he didn't go afk) so for example if someone get -15 lp for losing a game, then he should get -30LP + 5 Games suspension because he went AFK (ex: ragequit so he was probably the main reason why his team lost) and caused -as i said before- 4 other good players -who deserved to win that game- to lose around 16 LP each.
And this is where the issue lies: You think the punishment is too harsh. But considering that you can be banned forever, I'd say it's almost nothing compared to that. You are overreacting. Just deal with it.
: > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=7acup6vZ,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2018-08-13T18:11:53.913+0000) > > How would you know if a disconnect from the internet is real and not faked? > How would you know if pulling the plug of your pc is intentional or not? > How would you know if any technical issue is faked? > > Yes, clicking leave is obviously intentional, but everything is so ambiguous it's better to treat everything the same. you are missing the point !! i LOST lp for a VICTORY !!! i would have accepted getting 0 LP in a Victory, because i was AFK, but losing LP is def a stupid punishment
No, you miss the point. It doesn't matter if you went afk intentionally or not, because it still ruins the experience. Even if Riot wouldn't want to punish unintentional afks, they still have the issue that they can't detect what's intentionally or not. Also just to note punishment are designed to suck. If they wouldn't be annoying, no one would care.
: Well, we just went back to point 0. the system isn't fair, losing LP in a Victory game is not fair at all.
What if someone in your team goes afk intentionally to ruin your experience? And despite all odds stacked against you, you manage to win a 4v5. Wouldn't you want him to be punished? After all he tried to ruin your game. And what if he was fed just like you, but was tilted because everyone on his team fed, he was sick of it and went afk? Later he decides to come back and win the game. Does he still need to be punished? Riot says yes, because he still tried to ruin it for everyone else.
: > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=7acup6vZ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-08-13T17:45:05.178+0000) > > Tell me, how would you improve the system? > > Riot doesn't know if you went afk intentionlly or not. And the fact that you got low priority queue shows that you went afk before, intentional or not. You don't get low priority queue after just one game. get 0 LP for a Win and -19 LP for a lose ?? not LOSING LP on a VICTORY !!!
But you went afk. And it could've been intentional. This is why you got punished.
BloopyLad (EUW)
: Surely though a system can detect if you have returned to the game? Left the fountain or participated in kills or anything to show you are not afk anymore. Then it can dish out the LP correctly if you returned and won.
What if someone who goes afk intentionally to ruin the teammates experience comes back to avoid getting punished? That would make the system abusable.
: > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=7acup6vZ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-08-13T17:45:05.178+0000) > > Tell me, how would you improve the system? > > Riot doesn't know if you went afk intentionlly or not. And the fact that you got low priority queue shows that you went afk before, intentional or not. You don't get low priority queue after just one game. For starters, if you press the "leave button"? And maybe, just maybe, this issue isn't just a one-time thing?
How would you know if a disconnect from the internet is real and not faked? How would you know if pulling the plug of your pc is intentional or not? How would you know if any technical issue is faked? Yes, clicking leave is obviously intentional, but everything is so ambiguous it's better to treat everything the same.
: If you AFK for 2 minutes, Just don't bother coming back !
Tell me, how would you improve the system? Riot doesn't know if you went afk intentionlly or not. And the fact that you got low priority queue shows that you went afk before, intentional or not. You don't get low priority queue after just one game.
: > You don't care if this system actually works or not. I care about being treated the same as others :) > You just want to abuse a system for your own good the f*ck, what are you talking? What system do I want to abuse? We are talking about having the same chance as NA Players... how the hell is that abusing the system for my own good? Jesus :D > but because you can't you rant about it here. lmao what?
: > I'd ban unbanned accounts in this situation, jut to keep things fair and equal. First that wouldnt be fair at all for the people who showed they are reformed lol. And also funny that youre talking about fairness here when you are one of those "they are testing lul shit happens if u dont get the chance" people. Why would I be pissed? I wouldnt give a second thought about it. For me the only thing that matters is that I get the same chance to redeem myself. Cool for them proving the point that people actually reform over time.
For your information Riot tested something like this in the past before. However it failed miserably. And knowing how league is infamous for being incredibly toxic, I'd say there is a huge chance it will fail again. You are far more concerned about yourself rather than the greater picture. You don't care if this system actually works or not. The only thing you care about is that Riot should unban you. This is why you are pissed, isn't it? You just want to abuse a system for your own good, but because you can't you rant about it here.
Hydnoras (EUW)
: If i were a dev, I would test it on a relevant region. The riot support on eu for example can communicate just fine in English and EUW is 3 times larger than NA so the sample size would be better as well.
That's false. In europe there are many languages and Riot supports so many. It's far easier for Riot to test on a server where people virtually only speak in english while on europe they need to handle multiple languages at the same time. And if you are only counting in english in europe, you cut away a large portion of the playerbase.
: Why would they have to ban accounts who showed that they reformed?! That doesnt even make sense and they definitely would never do that lol. And right now accounts who were perma banned are reduced to 2 weeks ban.. that means if they start being toxic again they will be perma banned instantly again. So they wouldnt even have to manually ban them again. Which means: They can just announce a test run with a set time window where everyone can participate.. toxic accounts will be automatically banned again and the rest wont even if the test run failed. At the end of the test run they can decide if they want to keep giving permanently suspeneded accounts another chance or not.
I'd ban unbanned accounts in this situation, jut to keep things fair and equal. You yourself said you'd love to be unbanned, but if the system fails and such never makes it to EUW, wouldn't it be unfair that a few individuals on NA keep being unbanned while you and all other players on other servers never had the chance to redeem themself? It simply is not fair. Tests on small scopes give you a good overview about the great picture. It's easy and cuts down alot of work. If the system turns out to fail, then only a small amount of work is wasted. If the system is going to fail anyway, then better it fails on a small control group than on the global stage.
Saibbo (EUW)
: what's the point of occupying profile screen that could show more information then?
: Better to test it on a single server and if they fail the test you can just deny everyone else the same chance right?
: Well sure they can test it.. but as I said this is not a gamemode.. everyone from every server should be able to participate in this test run especially since data from different servers might differ
Great idea. Let's test some controversial things on a global scale, so if it fails it can turn out to be a huge catastrophe. This ain't going to happen. If this shit fails, Riot is forced to ban the unbanned players again. Imagine thousands if not millions of players being unbanned, which already is hard to monitor just because of the sheer numbers, and then introduce a huge banwave banning all of them again. This would create such a shitstorm of so many angry players. Many being undeservedly banned again. The payoff is not worth the risk and it is such a terrible business move. Small scope tests are save. If a small control group fails, then little to nothing is lost. If it succeeds, Riot will make it bigger, and eventually the system will come to EUW too. But if not even the small control group shows the improvement Riot is looking for, then it will inevitably fail on the global scale as well.
: The forgotten ADC, Kalista...
Kalista is OP. But in a balanced state she is unplayable. So here we are.
: What is the point of showing the Honor logo when we can't see other peoples Honor?
Riot fears that people can shame others if they see someone elses honor level.
: So people from NA get the chance to show they have reformed and the EU Playerbase might not just because they are "testing" it? Thats huge bullshit.. and your explanatio doesnt make any sense lol This is not a new gamemode or whatever where u have to test it only on one server..
You gotta need to test it somewhere. And if Riot bans unbanned accounts again, then what do you have from it if you got this treatment? You really should show some patience.
: What's the most amount of games you've played in a row?
Ceberuz (EUW)
: What more proof do you need, then the countless threads that's been made over time?- last one being the disco Nunu case, 60+ games with 0/3. Riots responds in that particularly case for not doing anything, was that they were collecting evidence, which is exceptionally difficult to believe considering the 60+ games. If you always call it bad games or alternative strategies, just get rid of the term assisting enemy team or intentionally feeding, because it doesn't exist then. I am not saying people should be banned instantly for a single game where they may end up with 0/10/3, because it can be a case of bad decision making, but when you reach game 10 with those stats or similar, it's starting to present more than a pattern.
Read my post again. Detecting trolls is in reality really that difficult. Remember that no humans scan matchhistories and so on. LoL is played by millions of millions of players, it's impossible for a human being to go through all of it in a steady paste. Humans are slow and on top of that biased. So an automated system needs be in place to detect trolls. But how does the system tell if someone trolls or not? In the end a computer needs to make the judgement but a computer cannot interpret data. For us humans it's easy to interpret anything, but the computer cannot retrieve meaning from anything. And this is the reason why detecting trolls is that difficult. Take a lool at this: https://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behaviour-en/YQ6vwtRY-proof-that-intentional-feeding-detection-does-not-work-via-in-game-reporting?comment=0007 It's a prime example of how the system failed to detect a troll. Riot still banned the troll, because a human made the decision. But the troll was undetected by the system. A human can easily interpret data thrown at him, a computer cannot and this is the main reason why such a detecting system is difficult to create.
: Specatator Feedback Option
There's a thing called coaching. Maybe you should try it.
: > But the most crucial issue with your code is need_punished. How do you determine that? For all we know that could be thrown by a random number generator. Also it's kinda odd that you use and int instead of boolean. >So what do we have? 12 lines of code and half of it is unstable and straight up problematic. So just from those I understand that I need some good time to speak with you about coding because we are not on the same level. So... There was the main idea about the punishing system. Who the fk know how the name the variables or the functions name. What I write there was random. I need hours to make a prototype to that system because you can asume that what is there is the full program. And the "maximum" and "minimum" are just some numbers that Riot's team choose them. _Riot team: So if someone say just 2 bad words in chat is not so bad, but if he say more that 2 he need to be punished. For max 5 words we give him chat restiction, but if he was toxic all game then we need to ban him for 14 days._ And here is the initialisation: _int minimum=2, maximum=5;_ And of course is recommended use the standard "int" if you don't type all the algorithm because you expect that who read this needs to understand what you say. Btw, " need_punished" is just a "returned" variable from a function who I didn't type it because I DON'T MAKE ALL THE ALGORTHM ON A FORUM because needs a huge amont of time to do it. >With technology I am not refering to the language a certain program is written in The "technology" contain the "language" so yes, you asked for it and I answered. They use languages (oriented object programming and others), machines (computer and others) and a lot of other stuffs (00:20 AM so I don't have energy for a better answer). Also you sended me the links, but I think that you should read them because you say something about typing in chat some word (just to see from where you need to read). If you type something but want to say something else then is not my problem. ######I don't waste more time about this thing because I can't find a reason.
I don't understand you. First you claim it's easy to make a good system, which I called out that it is not and now you are like "hur de dur, of course not! I need tons of time." Make up your mind.
: >do I know what technologies they use I know that they use a lot of C++ so is not surprising that the game have a lot of bugs. > When I type something like "I love you" into the chat, for the computer it is just a string of characters. Ones and zeros, nothing more. Is more like ASCII codes. The ASCII can be converted to binary, but the ASCII is a better way for saving execution time and resourses. They are have index numbers from 0 to 255. >So instead of teaching it how people should behave, we can create so called "masks" that the computer can use to scan the text. For example a "k y s" mask would go over the entire chatlog and checks character for character if at any given position "k y s" is to be found. If the computer found something, then the chatlog contains "k y s". The system already do this because there is not another way to see if the words in chat are also on the restricted list. But for this the system need a library where we can find all type of bad words who are writed in so many versions. Lets say that 2 Gb of words from a single language are enought to be verified. But for the system is more easy to search the chat words in the library because they save a lot of resurses. They scan the chat line by line and they put in vectors (e.g. _char chat_line[200]; gets(chat_line);_ ), every line is separated in words by the "Backtraking" algorithm and every word is searched in the library starting with the first ASCII code (e.g. _strstr()_ , _strchr()_ or even _strrev()_). >then the system punishes that player who wrote this specific combination of characters into the chat. _if(need_punished==1) { if(finded_words>minimum) { if(finded_words<=maximum) apply_chat_restriction(); else apply_ban_14_days(); } else ignore(); }_ _-_ The only thing that the can do (and is very easy) is to search all games where someone: * get killed 3 times in a row by a player or a tower * in two consecutive combats he do almost 0 damage or not cast spells while he have enough resurses * the time between spawn and death is very low * optional: the chat or intentional feeding function already have positive value. And this is how you make a detecting program with 5-6 hours of normal coding. Probably they already have one, but don't see like they used too hard. But this is the casual trolling, a good program about all things you say in the post needs some 3-4 weeks of coding (but still not impossible).
With technology I am not refering to the language a certain program is written in. Rather the algorythm and strategy which is used to solve a problem. If you ask apple which technology they'll use, they wont tell you "assembly, obviously", would they? The rest of your comment doesn't leave a good impression. You certainly have basic understanding of IT, and I give you props for that, but it fails on many details. For one your description about ASCII is an absolute abomination. For your information, ASCII is in no way used to store or execute data. It's no datatype like you make it seem to be. It's a character encoding norm which is used to interpret one byte of data. And as a matter of fact it is **NOT** ASCII that Riot is using to display characters. Look, I just went ingame and took this screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/afSITv3.png ASCII doesn't encode these characters, which means if Riot would've used ASCII LoL would display something completely different. Riot most likely uses some unicode standard. Which one I don't know, or maybe they use an encoding technology I am unaware of, I really don't know. Unicode is just fairly popular, so I am taking a shot and say they most likely use that. Go check wikipedia for more info: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASCII https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unicode As for the rest you clearly underestimate how difficult it is to interpret data. Also you assume too many details about a system we don't know how it exactly works. Only Riot knows what the code is and what it does line by line, all that we as players know is what it vagualy does. To try to explain to you how difficult it is to detect trolls, let me just get your code snippet and ask you, how do you determine "maximum" and "minimum"? Surely little differences in those two variables can cause and prevent a lot of punishments. These variables alone can make the whole system rather wonky. But then you also use finded_words to determine the punishment. Sure, the amount of bad words written affect the punishment, but ultimately the severity is more important than the word count, no? Also context matters a lot. I know in my past years I complained a lot about broken champions in game. Today I don't do that anymore, but back then I cursed a lot, making common use of swear words. However, I never flamed or attacked any other person. This is why to date I have not received one single punishment in the game. Your code would have banned my ass years ago, even though I did not flame anyone. But the most crucial issue with your code is need_punished. How do you determine that? For all we know that could be thrown by a random number generator. Also it's kinda odd that you use int instead of boolean. So what do we have? 12 lines of code and half of it is unstable and straight up problematic. Coding something that interprets data is not easy. Far from it. Retrieving meaning from raw data is insanely complicated. Why do you think so many people use machine learning? Because they themselfes have no clue how to solve their issues.
Ceberuz (EUW)
: Nice click-bait tile, and even nicer attempt at making Riot look like they can't do anything at all against people trolling / intentionally suiciding to lose games. They placed a report option in the game to make people think it actually was a option to report players doing this nonsense, but instead of actually looking at the data they get (remember they also have access to replayes), they do absolutely nothing but let those types, run rampage for 60+ games. Then again, why should this be different than the rest of their game.., entirely RnG based in all aspects with arbitrary rules and regulations, unless you violated the PG6 rating. I mean, even a simple thing like when they introduced role assignments that players pick themselves prior to games, you can completely ignore that and do whatever with 0 consequence.
Here's the thing: You make huge claims with no backup whatsoever. But so do I. However, with my understanding of computersience and the way the system works, my theory holds up pretty well. Sure it isn't perfect, but it's better than yours nontheless. If you are right, then how about you provide some proof. Or how about you try to code your own system that analyzes data and detects trolls. Go get yourself a team of software engineers and work it out. And if you succeed I would bet that Riot would pay alot for your code. So go ahead and prove me wrong. I'll wait.
Reichs (EUNE)
: it is just the same thing with their flamer busting system. For example I saw a following conversation between enemy team members in post-game chat Player 1: k y s idiot Player 2: k y s? You will get banned for that lol I just decided to do a little experiment and I reported player 2 for verbal. After some time I got the announcement that reported player has been punished and I checked his op.gg, he had stopped playing meaning he got banned. So player 2 didn't flame but got a 14-day or perma ban. Why riot decides to make the system so sensitive regarding flame but not regarding feeding?
There's a misunderstanding. First I already said that what I explained is extremely simplified, meaning Riot uses a more complicated and simply better system than what I showed here. Secondly, how do you know x player was banned? The message you receive that somebody got banned doesn't tell you who got banned. And player x may just have stopped to play because life got in the way or some other reason. You can't tell if somebody got banned or not. Also, such cases are extremely rare, as the more complex algorithm that Riot uses also considers context. How that works is beyond my understanding, but Riots system can understand the context of a given word. On top of that Riot doesn't ban you for a one time slip up. Most of the time you'll need multiple offenses to be a target for the system. This means even if what you said is true, player x could still have a toxic record and be banned because of it. You don't know if player x was toxic before. You only know that one game and he could have been extremely toxic in the past. Also notice that in your example player x said the other player is about to get banned. I assume he most likely also threatened to report the other player, didn't he? And this is what is also considered toxic behaviour. And even if all of this is a false positive, player x could've went to Riot Support at any time and they would've unbanned him. It's rare that such a false positive happens, but to my knowledge all of the affected players got unbanned. In a nutshell the system works pretty well. You are missing information and make vague judgements without solid proof.
Febos (EUW)
: Removing it might the best thing. It's not relevant to the discussion itself. You can use a theoretical example. You can ever use me, as I play Shaco Support. ######I get some shit for that from time to time.
http://doyouevencomicbook.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Thanos-Snap.jpg it's gone
Febos (EUW)
: Well I gave links to my claims. Unfortunately it was last year and most of the "proofs" were deleted. The only thing that remains are the comments from both sides of the argument. I'm not here to argue about the Singed thing though. That is under the bridge. The dude is fine, everyone moved on, so I don't really care. The information is there for those that want it.
So what should I do? I am going through the all those posts at the moment. Should I undo crossing the part out? Should I keep the part as it is or delete it? Should I rewrite it?
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ibAu2ENQ,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-07-28T17:56:15.570+0000) > > This post isn&#x27;t about the Singed Support thing, it was just an example. I know. I just wanted to correct that information. Believe it or not, I've seen many people hold Riot accountable for that even though they were very lenient. If it was me maybe I wouldn't have a 2nd chance. *** > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ibAu2ENQ,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2018-07-28T17:56:15.570+0000) > > And it is highly probable that they use a mask to scan data. If it&#x27;s set up by humans or a neural network doesn&#x27;t matter, it&#x27;s a mask nontheless. Sure, I agree. The problem isn't necessary the system, but rather **our** inability to properly define what "trolling" is.
I wouldn't call it inability. It is just that trolling in itself is really such a complex thing to do. There are so many aspects to it and you can troll in many different ways. With our current understanding of technology it is extremely difficult if not downright impossible to cover every type of trolling under one simple definition.
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=CrystalFlame,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ibAu2ENQ,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-07-28T17:32:47.383+0000) > > Edit: I see whiteknight febos has arrived with &quot;he had a negative winrate&quot; argument, called it. Why don't you make your own investigation? I did mine when the problem was brought up to the public the first time. He had less than 30% as Singed Support. You're trying to bait me into flaming you. You can forget about it though.
Oh no, now I am confused. I crossed out the Support Singed part, but now you're saying x and he is saying y....it's weird. Now I have to do my own research. {{sticker:zombie-nunu-bummed}} I %%%%ed it up again. Trying to explain something but somehow managed to bring up a controversy and get people to argue about that instead of the actual topic...
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Rismosch,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ibAu2ENQ,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-07-28T17:15:48.304+0000) > > What we need is a new, better approach oto detect trolls, but to my knowledge there is none. Most likely there is one, but it is certain that we haven&amp;#039;t found it yet. The IFS system uses a combination of machine learning and filters (masks as you put it). Like the name suggests, it works like an artificial brain and thus it "learns". How does it learn though? We, humans, teach it. How do we teach it? With our reports, by giving it data points to analyze and correlate. Boiled down to its essence it works kinda like this. One of the services of the IFS looks at your chat and evaluates it by attributing it a number. I'm don't know exactly what numbers, but let's assume 1 through 10 where 1 is "super positive" and 10 is "super toxic"; zero if nothing is said. Then it looks at your history and decides if you deserve a punishment. The same thing goes for the "feederbuster" and whatever other services Riot has. The problem here is the 2nd part: our reports. The system must learn from us. We are its teacher. The problem is not even we can properly identify trolling. What may be trolling for you might not be trolling for me and vice-versa. So, if we don't agree as a community how can we teach the system? Then there's the other problem, which stems from the same thing. The ammount of trolling is, supposedly, way less than verbal toxicity. If there are fewer data points, then the machine will learn slower. This coupled with the fact that Riot can't make samples for training, makes machine learning for trolling a really hard task. *** I'm not trying to excuse Riot, but the solution isn't trivial. Right now the best thing would be to define what qualifies as "trolling" and have the community report those, **and only those**, cases. ######If I'm trying to teach you to say "Hi" and then comes another other guy and teaches you how to say "Salut", then you won't know which one is more appropriate.
This post isn't about the Singed Support thing, it was just an example. This post is about how automatically detecting trolls is more difficult than people think. And it is highly probable that they use a mask to scan data. If it's set up by humans or a neural network doesn't matter, it's a mask nontheless.
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