: > [{quoted}](name=Sinful Succubus,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=jlpoqAeL,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T12:26:26.639+0000) > > go to google. click on the "videos" tab and type "xayah jungle". then press enter on your keyboard For a start, why would ANYONE use Google videos? Also, he claimed he ALWAYS carried with Xayah jungle or Soraka mid/top with Ignite/Smite so I want HIM to show me HIS videos - or it didn't happen. You really gotta stop tryna come at me bro, you lost EVERYTIME.
> [{quoted}](name=FxxKYxxRxxT,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=jlpoqAeL,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T12:30:57.085+0000) > > For a start, why would ANYONE use Google videos? > > Also, he claimed he ALWAYS carried with Xayah jungle or Soraka mid/top with Ignite/Smite so I want HIM to show me HIS videos - or it didn't happen. > > You really gotta stop tryna come at me bro, you lost EVERYTIME. You talk like he is the only one to ever play Xayah jungle.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1m7j5PkT2U
Kashiro (EUNE)
: That's just a philosophy. Once you have a set of rules you comply to them or get punished. You could say it's company's perception on how things should be. Even if the tribunal work would be good enough i think the main problem (once there were no rewards) they pointed out is the speed at which it worked. You had cases stretching back weeks in time.
> [{quoted}](name=Kashiro,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=9dfY4uEH,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-06T13:02:22.722+0000) > > That's just a philosophy. Once you have a set of rules you comply to them or get punished. You could say it's company's perception on how things should be. > Even if the tribunal work would be good enough i think the main problem (once there were no rewards) they pointed out is the speed at which it worked. You had cases stretching back weeks in time. Ah if only it were as simple as "break the rules, get punished". That is sadly not how the world works. If the rules cannot be enforced then people will ignore them. For an example of this look no further than traffic laws. How many people do you know who actually stick to the speed limits? In the UK at least nobody does. However, you hardly ever see anyone running a red light. So why do people obey one rule and not the other? Because the red light rule is easier to enforce (you can cover more lights with cameras than you can cover stretches of road) and, more importantly, most people agree that running a red light is extremely dangerous whereas they think it's ok to break the speed limit.
Viridiam (EUW)
: This is a waste of time.
> Now you lost games with a positive score, because your teammates think this is some kind of hack and slash bullshit, and decide to ignore your tips and pings. This particular sentence sticks out to me. You believe (as many players do) that you know best and your teammates should listen to you just because you have a positive kda. Here are 4 reasons why your pings and tips might be ignored: 1. Your teammates don't trust you or agree with your decision. 2. Your teammates were already committed to a play and couldn't back out. 3. Your teammates were so focused on what they were doing that they didn't register the pings. 4. You were spam pinging so much that your teammates got fed up and muted your pings. One thing to always keep in mind is that you do NOT know everything, especially when it comes to the skill of your teammates or the limits of their chosen champion. With this in mind, just because your teammates don't follow your instructions doesn't mean they are trolling.
MrVört (EUW)
: I kind of Disagree with that people who Int, doesn't get punished. Reporting someone who does go inting WILL help, I usually leave a brief but elaborate explenation to why I reported just in case there actually is someone reading through it, and people who Int are usually flaming already so they're being "Loud" already, basically caught with their hands inside the Cookie Jar and Yelling to cause commotion... As for Trolling, what does categorize as a "Troll"? To me, it's someone who runs an Ahri down as Full AD and SUCCEEDS! Or some other champion that scales mostly with one stat but they run the Other, like a On-Hit Neeko Build that I've seen arodun which is completely Busted... Any of these "Trolls" that you call them, that picks a champion, builds properly but feeds, are nothing more then a basic Inter, and also do take to account that people will not be able to do well in EVERY GAME... mainly because you never know what the other players are thinking in the opposite team, some don't take into account in trying to think what they would do and put up vision to get insight to how they roll and how to shut it down. So no, it's not RIOT's Fault for TRYING to solve as much as they can, sure they can do better... but with people sitting constantly with /all crying "REPORT X! REPORT X! REPORT X!" and then just leaves the lobby instantly, why didn't you report the person you cried so hard over wanting reported? That to me, proves one point: You're just tilted and maybe a bit salty and just cried to report someone but failed to do so yourself, and then there it is your fault for RIOT not taking action, because you're sitting there from your own views with an ILR Comparrison: You're sitting there, seeing all the Rapes and Murders going on, but you don't call the Police about it and just let it happen.
> [{quoted}](name=MrVört,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=Ja4blphx,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-12-06T09:03:29.539+0000) > > I kind of Disagree with that people who Int, doesn't get punished. Reporting someone who does go inting WILL help, I usually leave a brief but elaborate explenation to why I reported just in case there actually is someone reading through it, and people who Int are usually flaming already so they're being "Loud" already, basically caught with their hands inside the Cookie Jar and Yelling to cause commotion... > > As for Trolling, what does categorize as a "Troll"? To me, it's someone who runs an Ahri down as Full AD and SUCCEEDS! Or some other champion that scales mostly with one stat but they run the Other, like a On-Hit Neeko Build that I've seen arodun which is completely Busted... > Any of these "Trolls" that you call them, that picks a champion, builds properly but feeds, are nothing more then a basic Inter, and also do take to account that people will not be able to do well in EVERY GAME... mainly because you never know what the other players are thinking in the opposite team, some don't take into account in trying to think what they would do and put up vision to get insight to how they roll and how to shut it down. > > So no, it's not RIOT's Fault for TRYING to solve as much as they can, sure they can do better... but with people sitting constantly with /all crying "REPORT X! REPORT X! REPORT X!" and then just leaves the lobby instantly, why didn't you report the person you cried so hard over wanting reported? That to me, proves one point: You're just tilted and maybe a bit salty and just cried to report someone but failed to do so yourself, and then there it is your fault for RIOT not taking action, because you're sitting there from your own views with an ILR Comparrison: You're sitting there, seeing all the Rapes and Murders going on, but you don't call the Police about it and just let it happen. So, anyone who doesn't follow the meta is a troll? Wow.... Just wow.
Forsan (EUW)
: If you can't differentiate between suggestions and just ignorant whining ... that's something else.
> [{quoted}](name=Forsan,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=9dfY4uEH,comment-id=0000000000010000,timestamp=2019-12-06T04:27:51.493+0000) > > If you can't differentiate between suggestions and just ignorant whining ... that's something else. It's more the fact that they have to sift through hundreds of threads like this one to find the few with any real substance to them. I totally understand why many games developers don't speak to the players because of how many ignorant morons there are just looking for attention.
Mikiihisa (EUW)
: Tbh they just need to do something in order to restrict account creation. The ill of this game is Smurfs, troll account and boosted account. Remove the smurf. You remove the frustration of being totally stomped by someone that way more exeperienced than you. You remove troll players that doesn't give a shit about the game they are playing because they are playing on a "fake" account. People playing champ they does not know and only do editings plays that fail 9 time over 10. They are diamonds player or platinium players and they just go in silver and golds and troll and int and they don't give a shit. That's what smurf does. Boosted account is the cancer of this game, everyone agree with it. You play your D4 promos and you get that boosted support in your team that litteraly ruin your game and your promos again and again. You play your Platinium promos and you meet duo-challenger boosting accounts and you get stomped. It's not fun, it's boring, time wasting. This start being a problem when 1 game over 3 contain a Troll smurf, a booster or a boostie in it, if not over 2. Unfortunately, people actually buy Riot Point with they Smurfs they buy 1 or 2 champs with its skin and let's go it's 20$. So they will never restrict account creation. Because statistically there is probably more chance for a new account to actually buy RP than for a old account.
> [{quoted}](name=Mikiihisa,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=M9Bxi9Lf,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-12-05T17:54:57.551+0000) > > Tbh they just need to do something in order to restrict account creation. > > The ill of this game is Smurfs, troll account and boosted account. > > Remove the smurf. You remove the frustration of being totally stomped by someone that way more exeperienced than you. You remove troll players that doesn't give a shit about the game they are playing because they are playing on a "fake" account. People playing champ they does not know and only do editings plays that fail 9 time over 10. They are diamonds player or platinium players and they just go in silver and golds and troll and int and they don't give a shit. That's what smurf does. > > Boosted account is the cancer of this game, everyone agree with it. You play your D4 promos and you get that boosted support in your team that litteraly ruin your game and your promos again and again. You play your Platinium promos and you meet duo-challenger boosting accounts and you get stomped. It's not fun, it's boring, time wasting. > > This start being a problem when 1 game over 3 contain a Troll smurf, a booster or a boostie in it, if not over 2. > > > Unfortunately, people actually buy Riot Point with they Smurfs they buy 1 or 2 champs with its skin and let's go it's 20$. So they will never restrict account creation. Because statistically there is probably more chance for a new account to actually buy RP than for a old account. I agree that smurfs are a huge problem with this game, but there is nothing Riot can do to restrict account creation. Many games have tried in the past, and all have failed. Instead Riot need to understand WHY players are choosing to play on smurf accounts rather than their mains. If they address the underlying issues there will naturally be fewer smurfs.
Forsan (EUW)
: "Actively looking to improve their systems" .... that's why tons of suggestions remain ignored in the boards archive, and never have I ever seen someone from riot discussing "actively" such thing with the community since they play the game, and know much better these problems than riot employees
> [{quoted}](name=Forsan,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=9dfY4uEH,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T15:36:29.064+0000) > > "Actively looking to improve their systems" .... that's why tons of suggestions remain ignored in the boards archive, and never have I ever seen someone from riot discussing "actively" such thing with the community since they play the game, and know much better these problems than riot employees We'll conveniently forget that the majority of the "suggestions" posted here are just ignorant whining, and the remaining valid suggestions have been discussed to death for years. I've honestly lost count of the number of times people have suggested a prisoner's island in one form or another, despite Riot publically saying they will never implement it.
Kashiro (EUNE)
: Tribunal was slow, and players as judges are subjective, machine isn't. Flaming is part of a problem, so you can't excuse it and it's easier to detect chat abuse than something about gameplay.
> [{quoted}](name=Kashiro,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=9dfY4uEH,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-12-06T00:46:57.461+0000) > > Tribunal was slow, and players as judges are subjective, machine isn't. > Flaming is part of a problem, so you can't excuse it and it's easier to detect chat abuse than something about gameplay. "right" and "wrong" are entirely subjective, and all judgements are based on a person's perception.
: Very fair point
> [{quoted}](name=NewDragongamesnl,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=MWJGHgUX,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T23:10:49.143+0000) > > Very fair point Yeah this pretty much sums it up. It's also why the camera is lock by default for new players even though unlocked camera is objectively better.
Forsan (EUW)
: At this point it's not even the players fault anymore
While there are definitely things Riot could do to help reduce the toxicity, at the end of the day it's up to the players to fix the "problem" of the trolls and inters. Yes I used quotes there because I don't believe there are as many trolls and inters as people like you claim.
: The first step to rectifying toxicity entirely from this game.
I hear this term being thrown around a lot and I've never understood it. What exactly is "soft inting"? How do you define it? Oh and in my opinion you are slightly wrong about the root cause of toxicity. "Soft inting" isn't the problem here, but more the perception that anyone who does something "wrong" is "soft inting".
Killmore (EUNE)
: toxicity
Because to a lot of people it's not "just a game". Many players get very passionate and emotional in their matches, and this usually turns to frustration when they think that their teammates aren't pulling their weight. On top of that many players are so paranoid that they believe whenever someone makes a mistake it's because they are trolling or inting.
: if you join a competetive game and have a certain level, people have all right to expect a thing or two. and if you are 0.3.0 and u still ENGAGE a fight for example. every player should have the right to call you whatever he wants. since you are ruining their experience. also intentionally feed, not to know a law doesn´t protect you from it. at some point, flame is perfeclty fine. the REAL problem is, people start crying about words. sometimes they are just the truth.
> [{quoted}](name=Noobelsbert,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=hcFFE5Z2,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2019-12-03T22:31:39.527+0000) > > if you join a competetive game and have a certain level, people have all right to expect a thing or two. and if you are 0.3.0 and u still ENGAGE a fight for example. every player should have the right to call you whatever he wants. since you are ruining their experience. also intentionally feed, not to know a law doesn´t protect you from it. at some point, flame is perfeclty fine. > > the REAL problem is, people start crying about words. sometimes they are just the truth. You make it sound so simple, and yet I can think of a bunch of situations where being 0/3/0 and engaging for a fight is a good thing. You, like a lot of players, are trying to judge someone based only on their kda. Here is why you are unqualified to judge someone during a match based on their kda: 1. You didn't see everything. You didn't see what lead up to the death or what actions were taken by the players involved. 2. You don't know the matchup. Chances are you haven't played the champions involved so your knowledge on the subject is very limited. Even pro players don't know the intricacies of every single lane matchup, let alone what happens when you put a jungler into the mix too. 3. You don't know the player. You have no idea about the mental state of the players involved, nor do you know what they were thinking or trying to do when they died. "the REAL problem is, people start crying about words. sometimes they are just the truth." The truth as YOU see it using very limited information. The greatest sin is judgement without knowledge.
: > [{quoted}](name=Hansiman,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=hcFFE5Z2,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-12-02T16:32:03.110+0000) > > It's pretty much impossible to permaban a player, rather than the account. > > How would you prevent a person from creating a new account? IP Ban! Checkmate Greeny.
> [{quoted}](name=LightOfTheSeven,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=hcFFE5Z2,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2019-12-02T16:39:53.890+0000) > > IP Ban! > > Checkmate Greeny. It takes me about the same amount of time to change my IP address as it does to create a new LoL account.....
RayleighTT (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Wandering Mist,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=2nJP1kb9,comment-id=00000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-01T23:05:14.078+0000) > > "Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence" > > People make mistakes, people get tilted, people under pressure do things they wouldn't normally do. Now, I can only speak for myself here but sometimes I feel like I have to play perfectly in a match because if I make a single mistake or bad decision I will be flamed and called a troll. This added pressure to perform causes me to make mistakes that I usually wouldn't make. > > It's got to the point where i struggle to play because I'm so on edge. I've been blamed so many times, been called a troll and an inter so many times that it's all I can think about. Even turning the chat off doesn't help. > > It's not like the words being said to me are that bad. Nobody tells me to get cancer or kill myself or anything like that, but the pressure to perform and the fear of being blamed for everything means I can't enjoy the game. > > That is the effect your attitude has on players like me. YOU are the reason why there are so many "trolls" in this game. same they get tilted when they speak as they wish , but the point is that they don't get forgived because of that... , so stop find excuses , troll/grief or flame doesn't mather as long as you broke rules ,doesn't mather who made you angry ,who started and what ever you think about, rules are rules , if someone broke them , then he should answer for them ,same as someone who is a bit negative and get punishments even if someone can be offensed or not of what you could say ... ,same to be for who ever attempt to troll/grief. I have nothing to say about mistakes ,but everyone should know that mistakes can't cover the troll/grief ! , because if you do 1 mistake hundreds of games ,that's no longer a mistake , is something you do intentionally , and here is not about that , here is about the fact that most of people who perform in such state that they lower considerably them chances to even stand to win the game , serve no purpose to be into ranked !!! , and if you get someone who lower your chances to victory highly , then is not your fault for lossing the game , is Riot fault because they step to leave him to play ranked ,and players will get angry , and 1 guy who may be unhappy because he is not allowed to play ranked , is much more better than having 4 other players angry + the guy who perform bad angry(because he can be insulted) to find someone who doesn't belong to play competitive ranked into them teams... . Because the point of this game is a team game , and from the moment you don't do anything for your team , and don't step to fight for win , or to stop from doing so worse and pushing your team to defeat , and then just stand to say open lane and to surrender and destroy much more others game, is more than obvious such a player not belong in ranked ,not even if he get 14 days , he not deserve to be 5 years in ranked for that!.
> [{quoted}](name=RayleighTT,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=2nJP1kb9,comment-id=000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-01T23:30:49.307+0000) > > same they get tilted when they speak as they wish , but the point is that they don't get forgived because of that... , so stop find excuses , troll/grief or flame doesn't mather as long as you broke rules ,doesn't mather who made you angry ,who started and what ever you think about, rules are rules , if someone broke them , then he should answer for them ,same as someone who is a bit negative and get punishments even if someone can be offensed or not of what you could say ... ,same to be for who ever attempt to troll/grief. > > > I have nothing to say about mistakes ,but everyone should know that mistakes can't cover the troll/grief ! , because if you do 1 mistake hundreds of games ,that's no longer a mistake , is something you do intentionally , and here is not about that , here is about the fact that most of people who perform in such state that they lower considerably them chances to even stand to win the game , serve no purpose to be into ranked !!! , and if you get someone who lower your chances to victory highly , then is not your fault for lossing the game , is Riot fault because they step to leave him to play ranked ,and players will get angry , and 1 guy who may be unhappy because he is not allowed to play ranked , is much more better than having 4 other players angry + the guy who perform bad angry(because he can be insulted) to find someone who doesn't belong to play competitive ranked into them teams... . > > > Because the point of this game is a team game , and from the moment you don't do anything for your team , and don't step to fight for win , or to stop from doing so worse and pushing your team to defeat , and then just stand to say open lane and to surrender and destroy much more others game, is more than obvious such a player not belong in ranked ,not even if he get 14 days , he not deserve to be 5 years in ranked for that!. That's called victim blaming, and that's a very dangerous path to tread on. I'm not going to reply to you about this now because it's clear you don't understand the consequences of your toxic attitude, and nothing I can say it fix it for you. Actually, I'll say one last thing. I encourage you to watch the first 2 matches from this stream broadcast, which demonstrates exactly why your mindset is so wrong. I both games the streamer is trying his hardest but things go wrong and his team blames him for it. https://m.twitch.tv/videos/514580708 That is what your toxic mindset and threads like this create.
Yraco (EUW)
: I think it's a reasonable explanation. There will always be people that cause problems for seemingly no reason and all you can do is learn to cope with them. It's not even that hard in this case since it's possible to just mute them and not even see what they're saying.
> [{quoted}](name=Yraco,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=bmyfIJ9O,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2019-12-01T23:35:46.905+0000) > > I think it's a reasonable explanation. > There will always be people that cause problems for seemingly no reason and all you can do is learn to cope with them. It's not even that hard in this case since it's possible to just mute them and not even see what they're saying. There are actually very few people with that kind of "joker-like" mentality. Most people do mean or stupid things either out of ignorance or as a by-product of their circumstances. Any doctor will tell you that when people are in a highly emotional state they tend to do things verbally or physically that they wouldn't normally do. On the Internet this happens more often because it's easier to dehumanise someone when you aren't face to face with them. Most people aren't inherently "evil" but the mind works in strange ways, allowing us to justify certain actions that we know are against our morals. Stockholm Syndrome is an example of this. When someone gets put in a highly stressful situation the brain tries to protect us by altering our perception of what is going on. In other words it's a defense mechanism designed to help us cope with difficult situations. Now of course this is an extreme example but the same principle applies here, just in a milder context.
: Stop trying to make Dota 2 supports
> The whole "supports that can carry" is not something that should be in league of legends. OK, why? Why is it acceptable in dota2 but not in LoL?
RayleighTT (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Wandering Mist,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=2nJP1kb9,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2019-12-01T22:38:07.515+0000) > > Because I believe threads like this only make things worse. You're asking Riot to fix a problem that doesn't exist, as well as encouraging other playersto see everyone around them as a troll. > > It's this kind of attitude that has made the community so toxic. tell that to yourself, because i seen more than 10 players who intentionally grief/troll and i had to manually report them to do something against them , and if that's without importance , i meet hundreds of players who grief and lately troll throught another behaviour , from roaming whole game from a role to another lane intentionally ,without reasons , or just doing everything possible to don't be support players and much more... ( not exactly to say he doesn't protect you 3-4 times, but when the whole game he act like you don't exist and doesn't save or protect you , that is grief , i can take it even as troll , if your jungler says that he will not gank a lane ... that looks like grief too , expecially if he do that because some conversation with someone! , no mather what kind of players are in a game ,someone have to do his role and do what he must do to help everyone , no mather of it's reasons they find to don't do it ) . I seen players who step to go back into a fight low hp, while being low hp and having capacity to escape , and you will tell me that a guy like that is a bad player ,what if the enemy was full hp and the guy who go back into the fight was 200 hp ... , how it does makes sense for him to return the fight.. I seen players who start to troll for not getting ganked , who open lanes ,who intentionally afk(which indeed is a form of grief/troll when you leave without reason and you likely make your team to play 4 vs 5 ! ) , i seen players who don't use spells intentionally and let you die ... , how about that , when will Riot actually be able to detect that... I seen people who play more likely against them own team , in competitive gameplay, ignoring any advice , then they just continue to do what ever they wished to ,they never turn to do something for team , those players get wins for nothing , and loss for good reasons , so why such players are really not guilty for them gameplay ,when they play competitive ... . I am not toxic, i know very well to behave myself ,and to don't leave any person ,no mather of what kind of behaviour he have to interact with what person i am . The problem is there , if you don't see it , doesn't mean i can't see it , and if i am a normal player and loss my time to write about ,then wouldn't have a point to complain about something doesn't exist... , or you make me insane ???? , i have over 30 cases of grief/troll last year i seen ... , and i not want to give a bigger number , i give you one decent ,because i just added the number of cases where people intentionally troll/grief , not the complete number ,where i seen players doing something else ,or being totally a "-" for them team in ranked competitive ! .
> [{quoted}](name=RayleighTT,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=2nJP1kb9,comment-id=0000000100000000,timestamp=2019-12-01T22:47:45.499+0000) > > tell that to yourself, because i seen more than 10 players who intentionally grief/troll and i had to manually report them to do something against them , and if that's without importance , i meet hundreds of players who grief and lately troll throught another behaviour , from roaming whole game from a role to another lane intentionally ,without reasons , or just doing everything possible to don't be support players and much more... > > > I seen players who step to go back into a fight one someone with 200 hp , and you will tell me that a guy like that is a bad player ,what if the enemy was full hp and the guy who go back into the fight was 200 hp ... , how it does makes sense for him to return the fight.. > > > I seen players who start to troll for not getting ganked , who open lanes ,who intentionally afk(which indeed is a form of grief/troll when you leave without reason and you likely make your team to play 4 vs 5 ! ) , i seen players who don't use spells intentionally and let you die ... , how about that , when will Riot actually be able to detect that... > > I seen people who play more likely against them own team , in competitive gameplay, ignoring any advice , then they just continue to do what ever they wished to ... . > > I am not toxic, i know very well to behave myself ,and to don't leave any person ,no mather of what kind of behaviour he have to interact with what person i am . The problem is there , if you don't see it , doesn't mean i can't see it , and if i am a normal player and loss my time to write about ,then wouldn't have a point to complain about something doesn't exist... , or you make me insane ???? , i have over 30 cases of grief/troll last year i seen ... , and i not want to give a bigger number , i give you one decent ,because i just added the number of cases where people intentionally troll/grief , not the complete number ,where i seen players doing something else ,or being totally a - for the team in ranked! . "Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence" People make mistakes, people get tilted, people under pressure do things they wouldn't normally do. Now, I can only speak for myself here but sometimes I feel like I have to play perfectly in a match because if I make a single mistake or bad decision I will be flamed and called a troll. This added pressure to perform causes me to make mistakes that I usually wouldn't make. It's got to the point where i struggle to play because I'm so on edge. I've been blamed so many times, been called a troll and an inter so many times that it's all I can think about. Even turning the chat off doesn't help. It's not like the words being said to me are that bad. Nobody tells me to get cancer or kill myself or anything like that, but the pressure to perform and the fear of being blamed for everything means I can't enjoy the game. That is the effect your attitude has on players like me. YOU are the reason why there are so many "trolls" in this game.
RayleighTT (EUNE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Wandering Mist,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=2nJP1kb9,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-12-01T22:08:09.359+0000) > > I'm down voting this because I don't believe there are as many trolls as people claim. if that's your opinnion ,then what serve the fact you downvote a thread because you don't believe it... , let it time ,to raise popularity ,and then come back and downrate if you think ,there ain't . Not everyone will loss more time to come boards to complain 4-5 times ...,that they meet troll/griefers.
> [{quoted}](name=RayleighTT,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=2nJP1kb9,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2019-12-01T22:15:40.550+0000) > > if that's your opinnion ,then what serve the fact you downvote a thread because you don't believe it... , let it time ,to raise popularity ,and then come back and downrate if you think ,there ain't . > > Not everyone will loss more time to come boards to complain 4-5 times ...,that they meet trollers/griefers. Because I believe threads like this only make things worse. You're asking Riot to fix a problem that doesn't exist, as well as encouraging other playersto see everyone around them as a troll. It's this kind of attitude that has made the community so toxic.
Osiiris (EUNE)
: NUMBER OF PEOPLE TROLLING IN RANKED GAME IS TOO HIGH
Care to give an example from one of your recent ranked matches? I'd love to see these trolls of yours in action.
RayleighTT (EUNE)
: Subscribe against troll/grief
I'm down voting this because I don't believe there are as many trolls as people claim.
: You do realize that you are complaining about basic human nature right? _Q: Why are people so mean? A: Because they are human._
> [{quoted}](name=Sunney Drake,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=bmyfIJ9O,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-12-01T19:38:32.214+0000) > > You do realize that you are complaining about basic human nature right? > > _Q: Why are people so mean? > A: Because they are human._ It's a little more complicated than that.
Hansiman (EUW)
: > I was referring to a time before the IFS was implemented. The reason why Riot introduced such a system was because they had too many reports for a team of humans to go through, the majority of which are false reports sent out of anger than anything else. I don't think false reports were much of a problem there either. People forget that before the IFS, the Tribunal Voting System also had a filter in place to detect cases. The difference was that the old system didn't hand out penalties automatically, while IFS does. False reports were for the most part filtered out back then, as well as report weight being a thing during that time. Cases that appeared in the Tribunal were cases that the system believed was most likely to be punished, and humans verified it. It was already pretty accurate back then, but the IFS we have today is far more accurate. When it came out, 1 / 6000 cases received a wrong verdict, which is honestly well within an acceptable range. --- > Yes, report and move on without thinking about the consequences of what they are doing. Imagine if all it took to get someone arrested was to press 3 buttons. It's insane. But that's not how it works, and I'm sure you know it. You don't get someone banned by pressing 3 buttons. At best, you'll start an investigation into the behavior of the person you reported, and the result of that investigation is what causes a penalty. Your reports is not the direct cause of punishment.
> [{quoted}](name=Hansiman,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=UOnlAZ5v,comment-id=0002000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-12-01T10:24:06.047+0000) > > I don't think false reports were much of a problem there either. People forget that before the IFS, the Tribunal Voting System also had a filter in place to detect cases. The difference was that the old system didn't hand out penalties automatically, while IFS does. False reports were for the most part filtered out back then, as well as report weight being a thing during that time. > > Cases that appeared in the Tribunal were cases that the system believed was most likely to be punished, and humans verified it. It was already pretty accurate back then, but the IFS we have today is far more accurate. When it came out, 1 / 6000 cases received a wrong verdict, which is honestly well within an acceptable range. > --- > > But that's not how it works, and I'm sure you know it. You don't get someone banned by pressing 3 buttons. At best, you'll start an investigation into the behavior of the person you reported, and the result of that investigation is what causes a penalty. Your reports is not the direct cause of punishment. Oh I have no doubt that the IFS is very good at detecting and punishing toxic behaviour, but that isn't what we need right now. The problem isn't that the IFS punishes people, but HOW it punishes them. Consider this, when I'm teaching a group of children how to swim I don't actually have any real power over them. If they misbehave I tell them to get out of the water, but when push comes to shove I have no way of enforcing that rule. I have 10 children all refusing to listen, I can't deal with all 10 of them at the same time. Fortunately the children respect me enough to listen to me, and are disciplined to where they follow the teacher's instructions. Occasionally you'll get a single child acting out but this is usually easy to handle as long as the rest of the class are listening and obeying. Now yes, the IFS does punish people for breaking the rules but the punishments are meaningless, especially for repeat offenders. It's the equivalent of me telling someone to leave the pool for breaking the rules and then letting them get back in 5 minutes later.
: > [{quoted}](name=Sarchiapon,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=8gYmW4Pf,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2019-11-19T09:58:25.972+0000) > > Absolutely no offence intended...but please, talk for yourself. Not every player is a balloon ready to explode into flaming or trolling because they can't take losing some games. Maybe you are and you will eventually start trolling to spite whoever you think you should spite, but it's still going to be you, not everybody. > {{sticker:zombie-brand-clap}} Thing is you can mute flamers.... But how to win a game when someone trolls? Or 2 troll? By muting them????
> [{quoted}](name=ThyDelutionist,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=8gYmW4Pf,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-19T18:25:23.366+0000) > > Thing is you can mute flamers.... But how to win a game when someone trolls? Or 2 troll? By muting them???? How do you know they are trolling? I try my hardest every single match and yet I'm regularly called a troll by my so-called teammates.
Hansiman (EUW)
: > What I would do is make it so that in order to report someone you had to first review the replay and chat logs, highlighting actions that you deem reportable. The only result that I see with this is that people will stop reporting unwanted behavior, because it's too much work. --- > First, it will reduce the number of false reports sent out of blind rage which do nothing but clog up the system. I don't believe false reports are clogging up the system. Considering cases are handled within 15 minutes of case creation, there's not much suggesting the system is struggling with false reports. --- > Second, it gives players a chance to see what happened from an outside perspective. It is impossible to judge someone's gameplay accurately in the middle of a match. The added time it takes to do this will also give players time to cool off a little and make proper judgements. And I think a lot of people wouldn't really see any difference when reviewing the game. If they cool down, odds are they'll just move on and don't bother reporting. That won't really help anyone, other than reducing the odds that someone misbehaving is punished. The suggestion for people that encounter players intentionally trying to lose is "report and move on". --- > No, giving up means that I've realised the futility of the situation. I am not in a position to make a difference. But you are, because people are strong in numbers. In pretty much every election in my country (and many other countries) those that don't bother voting because "I have no power" actually represent such a large group that if they did vote, they'd often shift the political power. Don't underestimate how much you have to say.
> The only result that I see with this is that people will stop reporting unwanted behavior, because it's too much work. "unwanted" behaviour can be anything from a jungler not ganking a lane, to a support taking a single cs. From my experience the majority of players can't tell the difference between a troll and someone having a bad game. We need to TEACH the players, not just endlessly "punish" them for their negative attitudes. > I don't believe false reports are clogging up the system. Considering cases are handled within 15 minutes of case creation, there's not much suggesting the system is struggling with false reports. I was referring to a time before the IFS was implemented. The reason why Riot introduced such a system was because they had too many reports for a team of humans to go through, the majority of which are false reports sent out of anger than anything else. > And I think a lot of people wouldn't really see any difference when reviewing the game. If they cool down, odds are they'll just move on and don't bother reporting. That won't really help anyone, other than reducing the odds that someone misbehaving is punished. The suggestion for people that encounter players intentionally trying to lose is "report and move on". Yes, report and move on without thinking about the consequences of what they are doing. Imagine if all it took to get someone arrested was to press 3 buttons. It's insane. > But you are, because people are strong in numbers. In pretty much every election in my country (and many other countries) those that don't bother voting because "I have no power" actually represent such a large group that if they did vote, they'd often shift the political power. Don't underestimate how much you have to say. This isn't a democracy where we get to vote on what Riot does. But sure, if you say I have the power to "change the world" tell me what I need to do. Right now we are in a situation where a large portion of the playerbase are so paranoid and delusional that they can't tell the difference between someone who is genuinely trolling and someone who is just having a bad game. This attitude is exacerbated by the fact that players don't trust the matchmaking and there are a huge number of smurfs running around screwing things over. I'm not saying that my ideas will make things better, but at the moment the current system is causing more harm than good.
Hansiman (EUW)
: I'm sorry you seem to have such a negative view on the community. It's really not the community I encounter, because most of whom I encounter are perfectly fine. --- > The majority of the players don't respect Riot or want to obey the rules. I'm honestly not sure how you can come to this conclusion. If you're basing it on how players interact on the boards/reddit, that's always going to skew your view in a negative way. It's common for people to come complain on the boards when they're unhappy, or gotten punished. It's not common for players to come state on the boards when they're happy about something ingame, because they're just going to keep on playing. When people want to vent, the boards is a usual place to go. --- > Riot are incapable of enforcing their rules. All you need to do to see that this isn't the case, is read the boards and see that players get punished. If you're after perfection, and every single player breaking the rules will always get punished, then you're going to be disappointed, because that will never happen. No justice system in the world holds that accuracy, so don't expect Riot to be able to do so either. --- > The only way things will improve is if the majority of the games population abandon the 1v9 mindset and stop seeing everyone around them as a troll or an inter. I agree that this mindset is a problem. These people seem to forget that the game is team oriented, and play it like a single player deathmatch. > Riot, from what I can tell, aren't doing anything to start this process How would you start this process? A lot of the players that seem to have this mindset already seem to think that nothing Riot says is valid, so why would they listen? > While there are a few with the correct mindset, they are few and far between (the only ones I can name off the top of my head are Boxbox, Riste and Foggedftw) There's a lot of value in content creators like this. Riot has the LPP program that highlights certain content creators, although there's still a lot of work that needs to be done in that department as well. (Also, don't forget Voyboy. Bizzleberry is another great attitude streamer based in EU). --- My point is this: Riot does do a lot to help shape the community. From my personal experience, Riot has been a very unique game company when it comes to devoting time and energy into their behavior programs. However, for these programs to work, you need the majority of the community to also partake actively, ensuring that unwanted behavior is reported, and mistakes from the automated systems are highlighted (be it false penalties, or people getting away). Perfection won't ever happen, but we can always strive to improve situations. Giving up just means that you're not trying to help, and then I personally feel like your complaints on the subject are rather moot, since you don't do anything about it yourself. It's like when people complain about political systems, but don't even bother voting themselves.
> I'm honestly not sure how you can come to this conclusion. If you're basing it on how players interact on the boards/reddit, that's always going to skew your view in a negative way. > > It's common for people to come complain on the boards when they're unhappy, or gotten punished. It's not common for players to come state on the boards when they're happy about something ingame, because they're just going to keep on playing. When people want to vent, the boards is a usual place to go. Because every single match I play someone start flaming, and at the end of each match you have someone who says "report x for [insert bullshit reason here]". I am well aware that most people who come onto the forums do so to complain, but that is just the tip of the iceberg. > All you need to do to see that this isn't the case, is read the boards and see that players get punished. If you're after perfection, and every single player breaking the rules will always get punished, then you're going to be disappointed, because that will never happen. No justice system in the world holds that accuracy, so don't expect Riot to be able to do so either. And what do those punishments even mean? If you chat restrict someone they express their toxicity in pings or trolling. If you ban an account the person either creates or just buys a new one and keeps on going. Players know that the punishments they receive are worthless so why bother? > How would you start this process? A lot of the players that seem to have this mindset already seem to think that nothing Riot says is valid, so why would they listen? I've talked about this quite often but I guess I'll repeat it. The main thing I would do is change the way reports can be sent in. Right now it takes all of 3 mouse clicks in the post-game lobby to report someone. This means players can quickly fire off reports without ever thinking of the consequences of their actions. What I would do is make it so that in order to report someone you had to first review the replay and chat logs, highlighting actions that you deem reportable. This will have 2 effects: First, it will reduce the number of false reports sent out of blind rage which do nothing but clog up the system. Second, it gives players a chance to see what happened from an outside perspective. It is impossible to judge someone's gameplay accurately in the middle of a match. The added time it takes to do this will also give players time to cool off a little and make proper judgements. I would also change the "reform" cards, because right now they are next to useless since they lack context. Leading on from the new reporting system, when someone gets punished they have to review the replay and chat logs so they can see clearly which actions and words their teammates didn't like (anything highlighted in the initial report would be highlighted in the reform review). Finally, I would scrap the IFS and return to human review for all reports. In my opinion the IFS causes more problems than it solves and is fundamentally flawed. > Giving up just means that you're not trying to help, and then I personally feel like your complaints on the subject are rather moot, since you don't do anything about it yourself. It's like when people complain about political systems, but don't even bother voting themselves. No, giving up means that I've realised the futility of the situation. I am not in a position to make a difference. I am not a content creator with thousands of viewers, I have no connections to Riot in any way and my relatively low rank means that most players don't want to listen to me.
Hansiman (EUW)
: And with that attitude, you can't really complain about encountering unwanted behavior. If you do nothing yourself about the matter, don't expect anyone else will. If you want to see the community improve, do something about it.
> [{quoted}](name=Hansiman,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=UOnlAZ5v,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-30T18:05:59.609+0000) > > And with that attitude, you can't really complain about encountering unwanted behavior. If you do nothing yourself about the matter, don't expect anyone else will. > > If you want to see the community improve, do something about it. I have. Countless posts and threads to try to help people on these forums, and it does nothing. I've spend hours upon hours thinking about it and come to the conclusion that the community of this game is irretrievable. This stems from 2 core factors: 1. The majority of the players don't respect Riot or want to obey the rules. 2. Riot are incapable of enforcing their rules. History has shown us that when those 2 things happen, society breaks down and anarchy reigns supreme. The only way things will improve is if the majority of the games population abandon the 1v9 mindset and stop seeing everyone around them as a troll or an inter. Riot, from what I can tell, aren't doing anything to start this process, and the only other people who can really make a difference are the big-time streamers and youtubers. While there are a few with the correct mindset, they are few and far between (the only ones I can name off the top of my head are Boxbox, Riste and Foggedftw). The others perpetuate the 1v9 toxic mindset and negatively influence the rest of the community.
Hansiman (EUW)
: Support is able to step in and hand out penalties when it seems like players haven't been punished by IFS correctly. That's why it's important to manually report players intentionally feeding as well, if it seems like they have gotten away with it in several games. Joining PS with the intent of punishing players is probably never going to get you a job there. It's not really the correct attitude to bring with you.
> [{quoted}](name=Hansiman,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=UOnlAZ5v,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-11-30T17:57:09.254+0000) > > Support is able to step in and hand out penalties when it seems like players haven't been punished by IFS correctly. That's why it's important to manually report players intentionally feeding as well, if it seems like they have gotten away with it in several games. > > Joining PS with the intent of punishing players is probably never going to get you a job there. It's not really the correct attitude to bring with you. Meh, at the end of the day it's a pointless endeavor. Riot cannot enforce their own rules so the IFS might as well not exist at all.
PurpleOrk (EUW)
: Not everyone... I only get salty when people do this in ranked. Because there's two modes, and normal is for fun and testing, and ranking is to compete. And I think most people understand this... Why they get mad in normal, or short of troll when picking in ranked, are different questions.
> [{quoted}](name=PurpleOrk,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=enkcLEGh,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-11-30T15:08:10.089+0000) > > Not everyone... > I only get salty when people do this in ranked. Because there's two modes, and normal is for fun and testing, and ranking is to compete. > And I think most people understand this... > Why they get mad in normal, or short of troll when picking in ranked, are different questions. That is the theory of it yes, but unfortunately it doesn't work in practice. If you are in Plat+ in ranked and never play normals, your normal MMR will be so low that it will feel like you are playing against bots. That's why a lot of people have at least 2 accounts, 1 to play seriously to climb and the other to test things out. I'd like to point out that I don't agree with this practice as it ruins games for people who are trying to climb, but I understand why they do it.
: Is riot looking for people to punish negative behaviour?
Maybe this is me being too cynical but I don't think there is any point in becoming a member of the player support team. For one thing, 99% of the job is done by the IFS and the only time a real person reviews anything is when someone writes to them demanding the bans be lifted. When that happens you won't actually decide whether someone is innocent or guilty, but just to check whether the system worked or not. You won't be allowed to think for yourself because you will have strict instructions to back up the decisions of the IFS. The only time I've seen bans be lifted is when the system clearly banned the wrong account due to a glitch in the software. Context and outside factors don't play a role at all. You agree and defend the IFS like a good little sheep no matter what happens.
RayleighTT (EUNE)
: Respect for rules 0.
Are you really surprised by this? Riot's entire philosophy is built around actively enforcing the rules through various punishments, but that fails when the punishments are meaningless. What's the point in banning a person's account when they can just buy a new one for £5 or less and keep going? What's the point in chat restricting someone when they can express their toxicity through pings and other actions in-game? The system DOES NOT WORK because the players don't respect the rules and know that those rules cannot be enforced.
Kurotsu (EUW)
: How many people read the board's rules?
Those rules were clearly written by someone who has never actually taken part in an active forums like this one, which isn't surprising since the moderators on this forum are also mostly worthless in my opinion.
DevinaKh (EUNE)
: You gotta be joking. What attitude do you expect from people who get their games destroyed and time wasted? Let me tell you something, he is right about one thing for sure. Trollers and inters do exist in this game, BREAKING NEWS MA DUDE. They really don't care and you try to climb. You want me to be all flowers and rainbows when I get 3 consecutive games with people that just enjoying fking my games up because they feel like it? You are literally defending this kind of behavior. You can't clearly make a difference between people that make mistakes and people that literally troll. You understand that there are people that refuse to communicate and just troll you because they feel like it? Had a Kalista support taking farm and going up to 14 deaths with Lee Premade. Guess who got reported for trying to talk to that guy and ask him to stop trolling? I can shut up and take it, for sure, I understand your point, but there's a limit, I can't take this daily, and on more than 3 games. The thing is, they got power over you, they can lose your game and you can do nothing, absolutely nothing, no matter how well you play and how hard you try. You can't even report them, because they know these bans come only for typing in chat.
> [{quoted}](name=DevinaKh,realm=EUNE,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=i447cHMP,comment-id=00020000000000000001000000000001,timestamp=2019-11-29T15:20:39.827+0000) > > You gotta be joking. What attitude do you expect from people who get their games destroyed and time wasted? Let me tell you something, he is right about one thing for sure. Trollers and inters do exist in this game, BREAKING NEWS MA DUDE. They really don't care and you try to climb. > > You want me to be all flowers and rainbows when I get 3 consecutive games with people that just enjoying fking my games up because they feel like it? You are literally defending this kind of behavior. You can't clearly make a difference between people that make mistakes and people that literally troll. > > You understand that there are people that refuse to communicate and just troll you because they feel like it? Had a Kalista support taking farm and going up to 14 deaths with Lee Premade. Guess who got reported for trying to talk to that guy and ask him to stop trolling? I can shut up and take it, for sure, I understand your point, but there's a limit, I can't take this daily, and on more than 3 games. > > The thing is, they got power over you, they can lose your game and you can do nothing, absolutely nothing, no matter how well you play and how hard you try. You can't even report them, because they know these bans come only for typing in chat. Thank you for helping to prove my point.
PurpleOrk (EUW)
: Armor / mag res no longer have any effect?
> [{quoted}](name=PurpleOrk,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=Hxk3vpME,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-29T05:48:29.096+0000) > > Armor / mag res no longer have any effect? They only have an effect if you actually BUY the armour or MR, and the majority of players below Diamond are more concerned with building as much damage as possible regardless of the teamcomps. The OP is a classic example of this. Looking through the match history and in the last 20 matches on Vayne, the only defensive item he has built was a spirit visage. No QSS, NO GA, always building beserker's greaves even when faced with a team consisting of Elise, Nasus, Jhin and Thresh.
: This isn't their own champion, they are all champions of the game. Ad mid laners are meant to be situational, otherwise everyone in front of you buy armor and it can become a pain way more easily than a mixed damage team. And I think that when you decide to play mid you shouldn't have one champion, three or four seem to be the minimum for me.
> [{quoted}](name=Lippoutou Club,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=Hxk3vpME,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-11-29T03:38:28.868+0000) > > This isn't their own champion, they are all champions of the game. Ad mid laners are meant to be situational, otherwise everyone in front of you buy armor and it can become a pain way more easily than a mixed damage team. > > And I think that when you decide to play mid you shouldn't have one champion, three or four seem to be the minimum for me. The only thing sadder than a meta-sheep is a meta-sheep that still follows a meta that is no longer relavent. The days of mages only in the mid lane and marksman only in the bot lane are long gone.
: It's definitely not a perfect system, it has it's flaws. But for the most part the system works just fine. It uses your mmr to find players that have similar mmr numbers.
> [{quoted}](name=Teddy Beαr,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=yKQunFwE,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-11-29T02:44:20.413+0000) > > It's definitely not a perfect system, it has it's flaws. But for the most part the system works just fine. It uses your mmr to find players that have similar mmr numbers. You might very well be right there (we don't know since we aren't told our MMR). But if that is true then it begs the question, is our MMR indicative of our skill level?
: « U ban my champ »
Mate.....You're Gold 3, teamcomp doesn't matter at all at that ELO. Full AD? Who the hell cares? Oh and you're also talking shit about what you do. You played a match today as Vayne where you didn't ban either Senna or Yasuo, and ended up facing a Yasuo, and you won that game going 9/1/8...... You ban your teammates champions because you are a douchbag, nothing more, nothing less. You deserve to be trolled by them.
Kurotsu (EUW)
: About the top and bot new areas
When the plants were introduced into the jungle nobody really knew how to effectively use them either. Give it time and players will start to develop strategies for those alcoves. I don't think they need to be changed at all, they are fine the way they are.
Rioter Comments
Hansiman (EUW)
: Most people that get punished are perfectly capable of understanding what they did wrong. The people who complain and post about it are a small minority, and yes, some of them will try to justify their actions. Chat restrictions are reform based, not simply punishment.
> [{quoted}](name=Hansiman,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ulyRPNZg,comment-id=000000020000,timestamp=2019-11-28T23:53:35.916+0000) > > Most people that get punished are perfectly capable of understanding what they did wrong. The people who complain and post about it are a small minority, and yes, some of them will try to justify their actions. > > Chat restrictions are reform based, not simply punishment. Let me ask you something. Have you ever looked at a rule and thought to yourself "why should I follow this rule?" I guarantee you have because everyone has knowingly broken a rule at some point in their lives, usually because they don't believe the rule is worth obeying. That is the key here. Just because you have broken the rules doesn't necessarily mean you did something "wrong", which is the essence of morality and ethics. The players who get chat restricted know that they broke the rules but they don't believe they have done anything "wrong", just as a person on the brink of starvation who steals a loaf of bread doesn't believe they have done anything wrong. Try looking at this from a "toxic" player's point of view. You are trying your hardest to climb the ladder, to get to the next division or league and prove your skill. Then another player comes into your match and intentionally ruins it for you. The natural reaction to this is anger which is usually expressed in flaming. At this point it doesn't matter if the player who "ruined" the match is doing it intentionally or not, because the toxic player believes it is intentional. The other common reaction is one of despondency. "Why should I care about winning when nobody else on my team cares about winning?" Again, it doesn't matter if your teammates are trying their hardest or not because you **believe** they don't want to win. In either of these scenarios, restricting someone from typing in the chat doesn't magically make them change their mindset. All it really does is give them fewer ways to express their emotions and make them resent the punishment system even more. What we need to do is TEACH people that teammates who do badly in a match aren't trying to ruin the match for them, that there aren't as many trolls and inters as they think, and that through better communication silly mistakes can be avoided. I have suggested ways to accomplish this many times but I know that Riot won't change anything.
Hansiman (EUW)
: Chat restrictions hold a very high reform rate. In the past, there were smaller time bans for accounts punished with verbal toxicity, but it was swapped out with chat restrictions since more players reformed. That doesn't mean everyone will, but enough to warrant the use of this penalty. --- > 2nd, Most people who get a CR just end up trolling the games they are in. I'll need a source for this statement. It doesn't sound realistic. --- > 3rd, I have proved this before, and if needed, I will prove it again (when I have the time), CR's are given out based on the QUANTITY of reports you receive. I I don't see any evidence in your statement. If quantity of reports were what matters, you'd see tons of cases where people were punished with clean logs. We don't see this though, suggesting it's the behavior displayed that counts. --- > 4th, Once you are CR'd, your account goes to '0' honour No, it goes to honor 1. If you're already at honor 1 when you get a chat restriction, then it's set to 0. But that means you've been punished at least twice. --- > and it's impossible to get back thus you cannot earn rewards and so, like point 2, why would you bother trying to win games if you cannot get rewards. If you don't improve your behavior, you won't climb in honor. Those that do improve, climb back.
> [{quoted}](name=Hansiman,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ulyRPNZg,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-11-27T18:42:31.634+0000) > > Chat restrictions hold a very high reform rate. In the past, there were smaller time bans for accounts punished with verbal toxicity, but it was swapped out with chat restrictions since more players reformed. That doesn't mean everyone will, but enough to warrant the use of this penalty. > --- > > I'll need a source for this statement. It doesn't sound realistic. > --- > > I don't see any evidence in your statement. If quantity of reports were what matters, you'd see tons of cases where people were punished with clean logs. We don't see this though, suggesting it's the behavior displayed that counts. > --- > > No, it goes to honor 1. If you're already at honor 1 when you get a chat restriction, then it's set to 0. But that means you've been punished at least twice. > --- > > If you don't improve your behavior, you won't climb in honor. Those that do improve, climb back. I think you are confusing "reform" with avoidance. The people who get chat restricted (as shown many times on these forums) do NOT reform because they don't believe they have done anything wrong. They believe they are justified in flaming their "trolling" and "inting" teammates. They also believe that the system is stacked against them by punishing them and not the people who "ruin" their matches. What they do is learn how to avoid getting punished in the future whilst keeping their toxic attitudes. This is what happens when you have a system that relies on punishment rather than discipline.
GUCCł (EUNE)
: In your opinion, best champs to one-trick currently?
By "best" do you mean the strongest? If so that is probably the worst criteria when choosing a 1-trick champion because by the time you have reached the point where you can safely pick that champion into anything, chances are the meta will have changed and your chosen champion isn't the strongest anymore. Nobody can really tell you which champion to have as a 1-trick because it depends entirely on the person. What I will say is that if you are planning to 1-trick a popular champion you should have at least 1 other pick that is similar enough to get by on if you get banned out. For example, BoxBox, is a Riven 1-trick but often gets banned out so had to pick up Fiora as well, who is similar enough in playstyle for him to enjoy.
NaG4zaK1 (EUW)
: Aphelios
Agreed. Unfortunately Riot are caught in a bind. If they stopped releasing new champions people would get bored and quit, particularly the players who have been around for a long time and have likely played every champion. However, every time they introduce a new champion they make the game harder to balance. Usually adding more gameplay options doesn't matter too much because games don't last long enough for it to make balancing impossible, but LoL is 10 years old and still going strong, so it is a huge problem.
Breccius (EUW)
: i don't believe all are trolls , but if one dies like a rtard i wanna say "hey u're a rtaard". all this don't be offensive is B-S. chat used 2 be a fun part of the game once upon a time until the moral snowflake high grounds appeared. i dont even rly understand, because u have mute just in case and that's all you need, these bans justifications of removing troll improving game is major nonsense ..... mby it's easier to make it pg-13 tho doubt since online interactions are not considered, not sure tho might lower the age.. it doesn't matter who here agrees or doesn't , fact is it's a competitive team game over internet and you will NEVER have a game where someone probably isn't wishing you 2 die at the moment or after.. i just imagine those defending the bans like kids that have not played DotA , CounterStrike , and most internet use consists of pages like FB, instagra, youtube, reddit,twitch(another major b1ach)
> [{quoted}](name=Breccius,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=i447cHMP,comment-id=00020000000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-28T00:37:06.195+0000) > > i don't believe all are trolls , but if one dies like a rtard i wanna say "hey u're a rtaard". > all this don't be offensive is B-S. > chat used 2 be a fun part of the game once upon a time until the moral snowflake high grounds appeared. > > i dont even rly understand, because u have mute just in case and that's all you need, these bans justifications of removing troll improving game is major nonsense ..... mby it's easier to make it pg-13 tho doubt since online interactions are not considered, not sure tho might lower the age.. > > > > it doesn't matter who here agrees or doesn't , fact is it's a competitive team game over internet and you will NEVER have a game where someone probably isn't wishing you 2 die at the moment or after.. > > i just imagine those defending the bans like kids that have not played DotA , CounterStrike , and most internet use consists of pages like FB, instagra, youtube, reddit,twitch(another major b1ach) Am I being a snowflake for wanting to play a game without being insulted for every "mistake" I make? And yes I put quotes in there because often I am blamed for other people's mistakes. That's the other thing, the majority of mistakes in this game are caused by miscommunication. This happens so often where a player dies because they make a play expecting their teammates to back them up, but the teammates didn't know the play was going to happen.
Ehhhh (EUW)
: What's the big deal though? Is it honestly that terrible for you? And I'm pretty sure its merging accounts across regions into one. I dont know. But either way someone would lose their username, and people would still be complaining about all of it
> [{quoted}](name=Ehhhh,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=LxQeLPj6,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-27T20:31:50.767+0000) > > What's the big deal though? Is it honestly that terrible for you? And I'm pretty sure its merging accounts across regions into one. I dont know. But either way someone would lose their username, and people would still be complaining about all of it There are some people like the OP who are very very attached to their gamer names, especially if they use the same name in every game. It may seem silly to you but it means a lot to them.
Breccius (EUW)
: man man man ,terrible mistake.....u picked the wrong guy to whom respond with this . i am pro flame, just let chat run.... moderation only vs spam is needed just immagining brings me joy KEKW
> [{quoted}](name=Breccius,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=i447cHMP,comment-id=000200000000000000010000,timestamp=2019-11-27T21:54:11.267+0000) > > man man man ,terrible mistake.....u picked the wrong guy to whom respond with this . > i am pro flame, just let chat run.... moderation only vs spam is needed > > just immagining brings me joy KEKW Actually, I consider you to be the perfect person to say all that to (assuming you even bothered to read it). You say you are pro flame, and probably go with the whole "freedom of speech, stop being a snowflake" angle. That's fine and as I've said before it's not the words that are the problem. It's the attitude BEHIND the words. If you truly believe that you are surrounded by trolls and inters then it is completely understandable that you would want to lash out at them for ruining your matches. I would probably do the exact same thing if I had that mindset regardless of what punishments were handed out. Fortunately (for me anyway) I don't believe that everyone with a negative kda is a troll or an inter. I don't believe that my teammates are trying to intentionally ruin my matches. Do I get angry when I see people making what I believe to be stupid mistakes? Of course I do, but I also understand that they are just mistakes. Oh and on a side note, people like the OP are part of the reason why Riot switched to using a computer to deal out punishment. I'm willing to bet he sends reports about his "trolling" and "inting" teammates after every match, which floods the system with false reports. Riot more than likely switched to the IFS because there were too many reports sent in each day for a team of humans to sort through. If there were less people with this toxic mindset of thinking everyone else is a troll, there would be less reports and less need for the IFS.
Breccius (EUW)
: > Because flaming = caring for the game, right? mostly yes, its not liek Billy starts a game and says lets flame some people today. over the years this is the game feel :noone uses chat, more inters and trolls. boards don't seem any different still going on about good work on the job banning a flamer but if it's working why it's just getting worse. and dont tell me it will work it self out it's been like 6 years alredy
> [{quoted}](name=Breccius,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=i447cHMP,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-27T10:01:31.279+0000) > > mostly yes, its not liek Billy starts a game and says lets flame some people today. > > over the years this is the game feel :noone uses chat, more inters and trolls. > > boards don't seem any different still going on about good work on the job banning a flamer but if it's working why it's just getting worse. > and dont tell me it will work it self out it's been like 6 years alredy It's getting worse because the system relies on punishment rather than discipline (yes there is a difference between them). The problem is that relying on punishment over discipline inevitably causes a backlash later on. People who are punished often enough come to hate the system and will either stop caring completely or will do whatever they can to avoid punishment without actually changing their bad attitudes. For example, most players know that saying "k..y..s" is some form or another is likely to get them punished. The toxic players avoid using that term not because they believe it to be a horrible thing to say but just to avoid the punishment. They still think the words and have the same attitude, they just don't outwardly say it. This thread is a classic example of how far the community has fallen. The OP genuinely believes that his matches are full of trolls and inters, and thinks he is justified to flame them for it. He just got a 14 day ban and yet his attitude is the same as it was before the punishment. He will come back from his ban and nothing will have changed so the punishment is worthless. Punishments are only worth doing if they are used to accomplish a change in behaviour, and that isn't happening at all. The OP believes he has done nothing wrong and is being punished unfairly which means he will just keep doing what he is doing after his ban expires. On top of that you have the players who have been banned so many times that they just don't care anymore. Their accounts get permabanned and they just buy a new account and keep going. Again, the punishment is worthless because there is no discipline to back it up.
RegankClPnH (EUNE)
: Riot is just worst
Did you ever stop to think that maybe all those trolls and inters in your matches aren't actually trolls or inters but instead just regular players who make mistakes?
SRT Nopliz (EUNE)
: Support, viable champs and builds.
Nautilus is still really strong as the only item you need to be viable on him is Knight's Vow. Thresh is also fine as he has so much utility that he doesn't really need any items to be viable. It will be interesting to see what happens when the pro scene starts up again which will give us a better idea of how major the changes really are.
: Can we kill off Heimer botlane?
> A champ out of his roles to fill a lane he don't belong? Yeah fun times, right? Statements like this always amuse me. You do know champions can change roles and positions depending on the meta right?
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Wandering Mist

Level 158 (EUW)
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